Pathfinder 1E Elf Subraces

[Wolf72]

Ok, first off I'm not trying to start a "OMG, no! we've had enough!"

... But I grew up on AD&D (1e) and still have a fondness for the Elven subraces (Greyhawk standard)

I would like some non-over-the-top ideas for different subraces. I think PF did a good job of congealing the different types of elves into one race. I'm pretty comfortable with simply making the differences a cultural one (like humans) for most of the subraces.

My basic ideas were:
Grey Elf-- cultural, maybe +2 to any one knowledge skill (they being more erudite and all) ... possible a +2 to all int skill checks.
Wood Elf -- I'd like to see +2 str, +2 dex, -2 con, -2 cha
Valley Elf -- + disguise as human, - skill checks vs normal elves (pretty sure 3x has that as official somewhere)
Wild Elf -- +2 dex, -2 int ... some other skill bonuses to compensate for only one + stat (maybe Wild Empathy as a druid/ranger, and starts play as illiterate)
Aquatic Elf -- no real changes, just use universal monster rules for aquatic subtype.
Drow -- done in the Bestiary.

like/dislike? I'm trying to update some house rules and I'm kind of stuck on racial distinctions for elves. Dwarves are easy, between mountain and hill they've got the same stats and are pretty similar.

 

[willvr]

Question:

Are these on top of what elves get in PF?

If not; as I think they're not, Grey Elves got a bonus to Int in 3.5. But your wood elves and wild elves need an additional +2 to go alongside other PF races. Though with Wood Elf you can probably do it by just getting rid of either the -2 Con or -2 Cha.

 

[Cantroy]

Playing in a Greyhawk campaign now...

but I think that having elves with +4 to int is a bit much with Pathfinder rules. I always liked the ideas of the various races and types, and there is a long history of them, as Greyhawk IS the original "world" of the game after all... Anyone care to try a conversion that makes sense?

 

[willvr]

Well yeah; but this is why I want to know if it's on top of or instead of.

I think +4 to dex and -4 to con is pretty outrageous too.

 

[Cantroy]

According to the old rules...

It was instead of, but still, yeah, elves already had the +2 to int, and I think that in gameplay it was more due to the fact that they were already "old" compared to any other starting class race. I.e. an elf just starting out has already seen humans die off as a whole generation or 2.

So instead of the +2/-2 it was +4 etc... One thought would be to use the rules in the advanced race guide, but I don't have the time right now to go through such a procedure /sigh I am busy plotting variant magic systems as I find the pathfinder rules kinda silly at times...

 

[Wolf72]

I would not place stat changes on top of existing ones, that would be way to much IMO

Wood/Wild Elves: I'd rather not give another bonus stat and give something else to compensate. Wood Elves would have to much stat mods going on.

Grey Elves: I was thinking in addition to standard elf abilities, but the bonus could replace the +2 spellcraft checks.

Valley Elf would replace the spellcraft bonus: +4 disguise as human, -2 Bluff, diplomacy, knowledge local, intimidate vs. other elves.

 

[amerigoV]

Ok, first off I'm not trying to start a "OMG, no! we've had enough!"

...
Valley Elf -- + disguise as human, - skill checks vs normal elves (pretty sure 3x has that as official somewhere)

Valley Elves should have -4 Char due to saying stuff like "Gag me with a Spoon", "Totally", "Fer Sure" and "As if".

 

[Wolf72]

Valley Elves should have -4 Char due to saying stuff like "Gag me with a Spoon", "Totally", "Fer Sure" and "As if".

Dude, +1 to your xp

 

[amerigoV]

Dude, +1 to your xp

IIRC, I think Valley Elves were published around the time that "Valley" slang was popular. That is one of the reasons I never used them in a game.

 

[(Psi)SeveredHead]

Ok, first off I'm not trying to start a "OMG, no! we've had enough!"

... But I grew up on AD&D (1e) and still have a fondness for the Elven subraces (Greyhawk standard)

I would like some non-over-the-top ideas for different subraces. I think PF did a good job of congealing the different types of elves into one race. I'm pretty comfortable with simply making the differences a cultural one (like humans) for most of the subraces.

My basic ideas were:
Grey Elf-- cultural, maybe +2 to any one knowledge skill (they being more erudite and all) ... possible a +2 to all int skill checks.
Wood Elf -- I'd like to see +2 str, +2 dex, -2 con, -2 cha

+2 Strength and (additional) -2 Con makes no sense to me at all. There's also no good reason for them to be more graceful than other elves.

The differences between wood and wild elf are miniscule. Wood elves used to be civilized but lost it and became wild. The game doesn't distinguish between civilized and noncivilized humans except for one or two classes as is. That's precisely the kind of thing that bothered me about elfitis.

Valley Elf -- + disguise as human, - skill checks vs normal elves (pretty sure 3x has that as official somewhere)

I will have to Google this. Never heard of them.

Wild Elf -- +2 dex, -2 int ... some other skill bonuses to compensate for only one + stat (maybe Wild Empathy as a druid/ranger, and starts play as illiterate)

I don't see a point to stat mods. I do like the illiteracy thing though as it makes sense. All wild elves would be "book dumb" but not necessarily dumb. I wouldn't give Wild Empathy; what happens if one is a ranger or druid? You would expect that combo to be common. A racial bonus to Wild Empathy would make sense though (any wild elf could try it, but only those trained at it can do it reliably, and these tend to be better at it than other elves).

Aquatic Elf -- no real changes, just use universal monster rules for aquatic subtype.
Drow -- done in the Bestiary.

like/dislike? I'm trying to update some house rules and I'm kind of stuck on racial distinctions for elves. Dwarves are easy, between mountain and hill they've got the same stats and are pretty similar.

You might learn something about the dwarf distinction eg none mechanically, because it's not needed.

Eberron distinguished Aerenal "clerical" elves from the continental "martial" elves pretty well without stat mods or anything like that. FR 4e also distinguished between moon elves, sun elves, star elves, etc without going overboard. Minor differences like different weapon proficiencies and skill bonuses. It's easier this way. Just take standard elf, remove one bonus, add one bonus.