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D&D 5E Ellywick Tumblestrum's Ballads of the Forgotten Realms (hypothetical FR Setting Book)

Personally, I think it should be much like the 3e FRCS (but updated). Update some of the subclasses and backgrounds from SCAG, add some new ones. Put in some monsters in, maybe some feats, and some magic items. Give a page each of info on the other continents.

I do think they will use the FRCS as a template and a starting point idea of what FR fans want from a setting book, but as I said I think it will have lineages as well, maybe alot of them. It could bigger too.
 

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hopeless

Adventurer
I admit I was wondering what THAT was all about!
So by classic setting they meant another book set within Faerun?
I would like to know what they're planning to do about the drow stuff they've been releasing after all that stuff about the Fey they've only announced an adventure.
So are we looking at something similar to the Vault of the Drow series to introduce their new Dark Elf societies?
 

vincegetorix

Jewel of the North
Red Wizards are always Wizards, Thay is very unkind to Sorcerers, your lucky if they just kill or exile you, if your unlucky they experiment on you first.
I know that's true in theory. But we've seen in the Stryxhaven UA that they can bend the usual fluff of a class and let the players decide the HOW of their character.

A sorcerer could be the scion of a line of powerful wizards or the result of weird and creepy experiments from the Reds.

A warlock could be a dilettante making a pact with one of the Zulkyr to learn forbidden secrets. A Red Wizard blade-lock could be a fun take on the Thayan Knight.

Anyway, I myself would prefer if the ''cross-classes archetypes'' would only be restricted for class with the ''spellcasting'' features, for example, or ''fighting style''. The player and the DM should work together to see how a Red Wizard Cleric or Bard or whatever make sense in their game.
 

dave2008

Legend
Actually the Monster Manual is the biggest D&D 5e book at 352 pages.
FYI, they said the biggest "setting" book. The MM is not a setting book.

Second, don't try to cover every single continent and region of the Forgotten Realms. There's too much, and the biggest setting book is 320 pages (Eberron). Even that book covers only one continent in detail, and gives a handful of pages for other continents.
 

I admit I was wondering what THAT was all about!
So by classic setting they meant another book set within Faerun?
I would like to know what they're planning to do about the drow stuff they've been releasing after all that stuff about the Fey they've only announced an adventure.
So are we looking at something similar to the Vault of the Drow series to introduce their new Dark Elf societies?

The FR setting book would likely be a revisit setting book he mentioned, not one of classic settings books, unless they don't count the SCAG in which case it could be one of the classic setting books,,but analyzing the current settings, I believe they do count the SCAG as a setting book, so FR's setting book is going to e the revisit setting book.
 

Urriak Uruk

Debate fuels my Fire
I do think they will use the FRCS as a template and a starting point idea of what FR fans want from a setting book, but as I said I think it will have lineages as well, maybe alot of them. It could bigger too.

I strongly disagree with this. From what I've seen, 5E does not take previous edition's publishing strategies for inspiration; instead, it sees what works and doesn't work in their 5E releases, and uses those as templates going forward.

Anyway, if they do revisit FR, I'm very doubtful they will use FRCS as a template, and are much more likely to use the most successful 5E setting books as templates (Eberron, Wildemount).
 

I strongly disagree with this. From what I've seen, 5E does not take previous edition's publishing strategies for inspiration; instead, it sees what works and doesn't work in their 5E releases, and uses those as templates going forward.

Anyway, if they do revisit FR, I'm very doubtful they will use FRCS as a template, and are much more likely to use the most successful 5E setting books as templates (Eberron, Wildemount).
Actually, the 5e format isn't terribly different from the 3e FRCS format, just dialing back on the hard data when it comes to regions and replacing it with more cultural info and hooks. And the obvious replacing 3e prestige classes with 5e archetypes...
 

Actually, the 5e format isn't terribly different from the 3e FRCS format, just dialing back on the hard data when it comes to regions and replacing it with more cultural info and hooks. And the obvious replacing 3e prestige classes with 5e archetypes...

Interestingly enough there are only 134 pages in the 320 page book devoted in geography (regions) including Realms and a single page on other continents, 44 pages for Character options, not including spells, 27 pages on deities and the cosmology, 6 pages on History, 7 pages on running the realms, magic got 12 pages. Within the geography section the Dalelands got a staggering chunk of space compared to everything else.

There is there is alot of room to shift space around within the 320 pages. Character Options don't take up nearly as much space, compare the space Prestige Classes take up, each of which is a quarter to half a regular class in size, to the small space subclasses take up. Lineages don't take up much space either, even if their is alot of them, although a deeper dive into cultural lore will. I think even at 320 pages they could make the Geographic (regions) section much bigger thanks to space saved in other sections and partly by the simple fact that books like the adventures already released, the SCAG, etc..., already have done alot of the work.

If they go with MM size instead they can go even deeper on regions or add more stuff.
 

Parmandur

Book-Friend
I strongly disagree with this. From what I've seen, 5E does not take previous edition's publishing strategies for inspiration; instead, it sees what works and doesn't work in their 5E releases, and uses those as templates going forward.

Anyway, if they do revisit FR, I'm very doubtful they will use FRCS as a template, and are much more likely to use the most successful 5E setting books as templates (Eberron, Wildemount).
What I see being potentially useful is if the follow the Eberron and Ravenloft model, provide informing Faerûn outside of the Sword Coast, and use the opportunity to update "High Fantasy" genre tropes to bring them more in line with contemporary tastes. So, yeah, Adventure generation material, game running advice,, etc.
 

What I see being potentially useful is if the follow the Eberron and Ravenloft model, provide informing Faerûn outside of the Sword Coast, and use the opportunity to update "High Fantasy" genre tropes to bring them more in line with contemporary tastes. So, yeah, Adventure generation material, game running advice,, etc.

I hold any game running advice section is small, I'm not sure it needs much in that regard, like what you put in it, that isn't coveted by the DMG or another book?
 

Parmandur

Book-Friend
Interestingly enough there are only 134 pages in the 320 page book devoted in geography (regions) including Realms and a single page on other continents, 44 pages for Character options, not including spells, 27 pages on deities and the cosmology, 6 pages on History, 7 pages on running the realms, magic got 12 pages. Within the geography section the Dalelands got a staggering chunk of space compared to everything else.

There is there is alot of room to shift space around within the 320 pages. Character Options don't take up nearly as much space, compare the space Prestige Classes take up, each of which is a quarter to half a regular class in size, to the small space subclasses take up. Lineages don't take up much space either, even if their is alot of them, although a deeper dive into cultural lore will. I think even at 320 pages they could make the Geographic (regions) section much bigger thanks to space saved in other sections and partly by the simple fact that books like the adventures already released, the SCAG, etc..., already have done alot of the work.

If they go with MM size instead they can go even deeper on regions or add more stuff.
So, if we use Eberron as a theoretical model:

- Chapter 1: character options. Update traditional Races yo Tasha Lineages, New Subclasses, maybe Tealms specific Group Patrons.

- Chapter 2: Faerûn Gazateer, focused on areas outside the Sword Coast, similar to Rising from the Last Wars Chapter 2.

- Chapter 3: Dalelands deep dive Gazateer, similar to the Sharn Chapter, considering the amount of material generated for the Dalelands by Greenwood, and the area being well suited to D&D High Fantasy mercenary adventuring parties.

- Chapter 4: Adventure generation material: tables, maps, seeds, the whole nine yards. Includes a starting adventure module set in the Dalelands.

- Chapter 5: Magic items & treasure.

- Chapter 6: Bestiary
 

Parmandur

Book-Friend
I hold any game running advice section is small, I'm not sure it needs much in that regard, like what you put in it, that isn't coveted by the DMG or another book?
Oh, man, Ravnica, Eberron, Theros, and Ravenloft all got huge mileage off of that sort of thing, particularly the tables that help expand on Chapter 5 of the DMG which make up a large part of all of those books. Definitely that would play a role in any new Setting book made by WotC, it's the point of the "genre vooster pack" model.
 

Parmandur

Book-Friend
I hold any game running advice section is small, I'm not sure it needs much in that regard, like what you put in it, that isn't coveted by the DMG or another book?
For context, Chapter 4 of Rising from the Last War, Building Eberron Adventures, is 80 pages long a full 25% of the book and about the same length as the Character Creation Chapter 1. Chapter 2 & 3 combined, both Gazateer sections, are slightly short at 77 pages: 47 for Khorvaire as a whole, 30 for Sharn in particular. I would expect roughly similar ratios in an FR book.
 

Oh, man, Ravnica, Eberron, Theros, and Ravenloft all got huge mileage off of that sort of thing, particularly the tables that help expand on Chapter 5 of the DMG which make up a large part of all of those books. Definitely that would play a role in any new Setting book made by WotC, it's the point of the "genre vooster pack" model.

But in this case what would you put in it? Somekind of Supernatural Gifts like Theros? A piety system based around categories of deities instead of individual deities? Whatever you do will likely transform AL. Faction rules like Ravnica? Unlike the complexity of horror, I'm not sure what kind of advice it needs for Epic Fantasy. Maybe Epic Levels/Epic Destinies Ala 4e?
 

Parmandur

Book-Friend
But in this case what would you put in it? Somekind of Supernatural Gifts like Theros? A piety system based around categories of deities instead of individual deities? Whatever you do will likely transform AL. Faction rules like Ravnica? Unlike the complexity of horror, I'm not sure what kind of advice it needs for Epic Fantasy. Maybe Epic Levels/Epic Destinies Ala 4e?
Heroic Fantasy, not Epic Fantasy (that would be more Dragonlance, per the DMG). Honestly, just doing a Tashification of the Races of Faerûn would make a meaty Character Creation chapter, and providing materials more particular to the Realms (tables to help develop Adventures with the Red Wizards or the Harpers) than those in the DMG.
 

For context, Chapter 4 of Rising from the Last War, Building Eberron Adventures, is 80 pages long a full 25% of the book and about the same length as the Character Creation Chapter 1. Chapter 2 & 3 combined, both Gazateer sections, are slightly short at 77 pages: 47 for Khorvaire as a whole, 30 for Sharn in particular. I would expect roughly similar ratios in an FR book.

Oh heck no, the lore is the core of what makes FR special, and Faerun is way bigger and diverse, a Geography section 77 pages doesn't cut it. The book doesn't need a huge running FR section, it's the default setting and folks have been running it for years now. That would be as bad or worse then the SCAG and unneeded.
 

Parmandur

Book-Friend
Oh heck no, the lore is the core of what makes FR special, and Faerun is way bigger and diverse, a Geography section 77 pages doesn't cut it. The book doesn't need a huge running FR section, it's the default setting and folks have been running it for years now. That would be as bad or worse then the SCAG and unneeded.
Speak for yourself, I love the sort of adventure generation expansion material that's included in Tavncia, Eberron, et al. An entirely lore centric book cannot compete with the Forgotten Realms Wikia, or the 3E FRCS already on my bedroom bookshelf. A modern Setting book, like Eberron, however, is a gold mine of game prep aids, which I value in a game book.
 

Urriak Uruk

Debate fuels my Fire
Speak for itself, I love the sort of adventure generation expansion material that's included in Tavncia, Eberron, et al. An entirely lore centric book cannot compete with the Forgotten Realms Wikia, or the 3E FRCS already on my bedroom bookshelf. A modern Setting book, like Eberron, however, is a gold mine of game prep aids, which I value in a game book.

Very much agree with this. I don't really want a remake of the FRCS with better art, layout, and "Here's what happened in the past 10 years!"

A gaming book like Eberron (which doesn't advance the timeline at all) that is primarily focused on "Here is how to run different thematic games in these various regions within a 5E context," is far more valuable to me.
 

Speak for yourself, I love the sort of adventure generation expansion material that's included in Tavncia, Eberron, et al. An entirely lore centric book cannot compete with the Forgotten Realms Wikia, or the 3E FRCS already on my bedroom bookshelf. A modern Setting book, like Eberron, however, is a gold mine of game prep aids, which I value in a game book.

I think it should fall somewhere in the middle. Obviously, the FRCS did go into unnecessary detail, but remember that Faerûn is significantly larger than Khorvaire, with a larger number of sub-entities, which will mean more room for the geography section than Eberron's did to amount to equivalent coverage. And since Eberron had to sacrifice space for the entirety of the Arificer class and all the info on Dragonmarks, there's a good amount of the page count which can be shifted without difficulty...
 

Speak for yourself, I love the sort of adventure generation expansion material that's included in Tavncia, Eberron, et al. An entirely lore centric book cannot compete with the Forgotten Realms Wikia, or the 3E FRCS already on my bedroom bookshelf. A modern Setting book, like Eberron, however, is a gold mine of game prep aids, which I value in a game book.

I'll take another look at that section.
 

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