D&D 5E Encounters per day and session time

[Valmarius]

In my town-to-dungeon campaign, The Delve, I structure it as of phases of play that start and end in the town of Grimdark. Each session is 4.5 to 5 hours of real time. The dungeon exists in two realities and is only persistent in the campaign world for at most 24 hours then it disappears for a week and repeats the cycle. So each expedition involves managing time well so as to get the most out of a given adventuring day. Short rests are 8 hours; long rests are 1 week. Week 14 is this Saturday's session.

I'll just add that I can't remember a session where we took the two short rests. The time pressure, and our tendency to bring a few healing potions, means we tend to push ourselves pretty far before deciding to rest.
Plenty of sessions end with us taking our first rest of the session after the Delve has faded, and right before traveling back to town uneventfully.

 

[Psikerlord#]

Yeah, that pretty much describes how we run our games now. The problem is, while that's worked in the past, it's made for some very boring sessions in 5e; out of my four regular players only one is really excited about continuing with 5e and even he wants more challenge out of our combats. I'm looking to alter how I run my games and was curious how people fit in more combats in a limited timeframe.

You might consider Low Fantasy Gaming RPG for a more dangerous variant - long rest 1d6 days, short rest 5 mins, common class refresh mechanics. Fixes many of the issues you are seeing.

 

[MonkeyWrench]

You might consider Low Fantasy Gaming RPG for a more dangerous variant - long rest 1d6 days, short rest 5 mins, common class refresh mechanics. Fixes many of the issues you are seeing.

Thanks for the link! I'll check it out.

 

[Flamestrike]

I've read a lot of threads lately where posters claim that the 6-8 med/hard encounters* per adventuring day is the best way to balance PC abilities against the standard monsters. I accept that the game system is based on this assumption, however outside of OD&D I have never found this many encounters, combat or otherwise, to be realistic at the table. My group's sessions last between 4-5 hours and we're good to get in 2-3 combat encounters per session; the majority of our session time is taken up with social enounters, information gathering, and downtime activities, none of which sufficiently deplete player resources in the way combat encounters do.

For the DMs who find the 6-8 encounters/day works for them:
- how long are your sessions?
- do you have multiple sessions that take place within one adventuring day?
- how long are your combats?
- how do you pace your adventures/scenarios?

I'm looking for at-the-table practices and strategies. There are many ways players have to control when and how they approach combat (scouting, divination, etc), and I know how to handle those. I'm looking more for practical tips on how to fit in that many encounters without turning every session into a combat grindfest (the most likely outcome of that many combats from my perspective).

Thanks

* Yes, I'm aware encounters don't alway have to be combat, but social interactions and environmental challenges rarely require the PCs to expend as many resources as combat encounters and the balance of the classes against standard mo alters seems to be based on gradual resource depletion over a long day.

Youre conflating [adventuring day] with [game session]. Theyre not the same thing.

Its easy to 'ping' a long rest at the end of a session, and many tables run that way, but you dont have to do it. Just ensure your players are recording resource use during the session (and make a note in your DMs notes at the end of the session to keep them honest). At the end of the session ask each player what they have left in the tank, and record it in your notes.

At the start of a session I'll make a point of asking my players questions about how many slots they have left etc (so I know as well, and to compare with my own notes).

It also refreshes their own minds, and reminds them how low on juice they are.

Ill also for HP totals (and other resource totals) during the session. Plus I'll make a note each time the Paladin burns a slot to smite, or the BM uses a sup die just to keep an eye on them.

I also regularly audit character sheets. Heck; I once had a DM who had his own photocopier and he used to photocopy your character sheet every few months (which was kind of cool becuase you then had a record of your PCs advancement.

Im not suggesting players cheat (although it does happen) but some guys bookeeping is better than others. Doing the above nips both problems in the bud before they happen, and lets the players know you're watching them.

 

[MonkeyWrench]

Youre conflating [adventuring day] with [game session]. Theyre not the same thing.

Its easy to 'ping' a long rest at the end of a session, and many tables run that way, but you dont have to do it. Just ensure your players are recording resource use during the session (and make a note in your DMs notes at the end of the session to keep them honest). At the end of the session ask each player what they have left in the tank, and record it in your notes.

At the start of a session I'll make a point of asking my players questions about how many slots they have left etc (so I know as well, and to compare with my own notes).

It also refreshes their own minds, and reminds them how low on juice they are.

Ill also for HP totals (and other resource totals) during the session. Plus I'll make a note each time the Paladin burns a slot to smite, or the BM uses a sup die just to keep an eye on them.

I also regularly audit character sheets. Heck; I once had a DM who had his own photocopier and he used to photocopy your character sheet every few months (which was kind of cool becuase you then had a record of your PCs advancement.

Im not suggesting players cheat (although it does happen) but some guys bookeeping is better than others. Doing the above nips both problems in the bud before they happen, and lets the players know you're watching them.

Thanks for the reply. My initial post must have been poorly worded as I've never made the assumption that an adventuring day = single game session. What I was curious about is how DMs who adhere to the 6-8 encounters/day guidelines pace their adventures. I suspected they were stretching a single adventuring day over multiple sessions, but I've never read of anyone explicitly stating it that way. That method hasn't worked for our group in the past as we don't always get to play week-to-week and player attendance isn't always guaranteed.

I'm considering using the variant rest rules, but I know some of my players with balk at needing to wait an in-game week for a long rest.

 

[Flamestrike]

Thanks for the reply. My initial post must have been poorly worded as I've never made the assumption that an adventuring day = single game session. What I was curious about is how DMs who adhere to the 6-8 encounters/day guidelines pace their adventures. I suspected they were stretching a single adventuring day over multiple sessions, but I've never read of anyone explicitly stating it that way. That method hasn't worked for our group in the past as we don't always get to play week-to-week and player attendance isn't always guaranteed.

I'm considering using the variant rest rules, but I know some of my players with balk at needing to wait an in-game week for a long rest.

Place time constraints on your quests. Recover/ rescue/ destroy/ defeat/ locate/ collect/ escape from/ discover the MacGuffin by [time X] or else [bad thing Y] happens

The PCs are hired or otherwise roped into slaying the evil necromancer. If they don't kill him by midnight he completes his sacrifice of several captured innocent townfolk, unleashing hordes of undead on the town. A further side-effect of the sacrifice is he also becomes a powerful lich. Sacrifice happens at midnight.

Adventure is structured in such a way that by the time the PCs get to the necromancers lair, they have about four hours till midnight. The layout which you have previously stated encounters of, features 6 to 8 medium to hard encounters including the final battle with the necromancer.

Then sit back and let them figure it out.

 

[pming]

Hiya!

I'm now asking, for people who average 6-8 per day, how they fit them in a 4-5 hour game session?

...don't have every combat encounter be average/hard? I mean, really, a group of 5 3rd level PC's will absolutely annihilate a trio of guards posted at a cave entrance. So, that's 1. They go in 20' and hear more guards up around the corner. They sneak, see 4 guards around a table gambling. Spell, arrow, arrow, charge...slash/hack/smash/stab. Dead guards. That's 2. They go down the corridor and it branches. They head left. It winds and weaves a bit into a cavern. They search and are beset upon by a small nest of stirges! Spell, arrow, hack, kick...a couple saves, some anti-toxin. Right, that's 3. Just these three encounters, for me, probably would have not taken up more than half-hour of our time, maybe 45 minutes with the exploration. With another 4'ish hours left....hitting 6-8 general encounters, regardless of "CR" (CR, IME, is useless or very well near), is no problem at all.

In fact, in an active underground foray, a 4 to 5 hour session can easily have 12 to 15 encounters. Some may be average, most easy, a handful could be hard. A dungeon is not (and should not!) be simply a mostly linear map with ever increasing challenges until you get to the end boss and there's a quick flash of light, a loud "Badda-daa-daa-daap-DAUUU!!! Reaaadddyyyy...... FIGHT!". If that's the way a DM is running his campaign...well, I'm not judging. To each their own I guess. Definitely not my idea of a good or even fun campaign.

At any rate, I don't think the question you should be asking is "How do DM's do 7 encounters a 'day' in a 4 to 5 hour session?". The question should be "How do DM's keep the players excited about playing during a 4 to 5 hour session?". That's FAR more important.

^_^

Paul L. Ming

 

[MostlyHarmless42]

What I wish to know, is how people manage to do combats so quickly. The concept of 4 combats in a 3 hour session is crazy to me.

Perhaps it's just my group, but even smaller scale battles seem to take forever. I've done about everything I can think of to speed things up, requiring players to preplan turns, roll all dice at once, prepare random encounters ahead of time, etc. The players and I are all focused, but it STILL seems to take like a long time to run combats. Hell, I've had multiple sessions where the entire 4 hours is a single fight on anything that is even remotely complicated. I simply have no idea why it takes so long with my group.

 

[Uller]

For the DMs who find the 6-8 encounters/day works for them:
- how long are your sessions?
- do you have multiple sessions that take place within one adventuring day?
- how long are your combats?
- how do you pace your adventures/scenarios?

I'm going to answer before reading the thread to keep my answer purely to my game(s):

I view the 6-8 encounters as guideline and I apply it to the "meat" of an adventure. Travel time, social interaction time, exploring the game world, etc, it doesn't apply. But when the adventurers eventually find the Temple of Googekmu that they've been searching for for the last 2 game sessions and begin a dungeon crawl or if they are trying to escape the Haunted Dark Pine Forest that is filled with undead...that's when the 6-8 encounters might apply. _might_ It depends on their choices.

I don't try to control it inorganically. I place encounters that make sense or seem interesting...combat, RP (or either or, depending on PC choices), puzzles, obstacles, etc. I place time pressures and other constraints to keep the PCs moving forward rather than resting and I use the 6-8 encounter guideline to predict what will and what can happen in the upcoming session.

They are assaulting the evil temple to stop a sacrifice and rescue prisoners before the temple's allies arrive...okay...the front entrance, the side guard room, the acolyte's quarters, the high priest and his body guard, the pendulum pit trap...that's 6 encounters. Add in some extraneous/optional side encounters and that's a challenging adventure with probably no opportunity for even a short rest at least until the main force of the temple's upper floor is destroyed. Add in some time pressure so they ONLY take a short rest before exploring the basement and we're good.

So specific questions:

Sessions: Usually 2.5 to 3.5 hours of actual game play.
Sessions per adventuring day: varies. Usually 1-3 depending (more sessions as levels get higher)
Combat length: varies. From 5-10 minutes for easy/trivial combats to an hour+ for hard, difficult ones
Adventure placement: I tend to give out 2-3 hooks and give them a vague idea of risk/reward. When not running a long 5E AP like PotA, I try to keep adventures lasting from 1-3 game sessions with one game session in between for downtime, exploration, finding new hooks, etc.