Evangelist from C Divine: can anyone make a case that it doesn't suck?

[Terath Ninir]

For story reasons, I am making an NPC bard 5/evangelist 3. As an NPC, he is perfectly acceptable, and has the skills and abilities I want him to have. However, I gave him levels as an evangelist pretty much only for flavour reasons. He'd be more powerful if I had left him as a bard.

Sure, the 5th level power is nifty, but until you reach that -- and there's a good chance this NPC won't, especially since he won't be actively adventuring while the PCs are -- they seem very substandard. You lose a good Reflex saves, spellcasting, bardic knowledge, and in this case suggestion, for some abilities that are really kind of dorky. Flame shield? Impassioned oratory makes people resistant to fire? Huh?

Am I missing something? Is there something I'm missing that makes this class worth taking? Frankly, I just can't see a PC ever taking this class...

 

[Endur]

I think this class is intended for evil characters. i.e. TV evangelist/con men

 

[Terath Ninir]

Televangelist, yes, but they have a choice of powers at 1st level, one of which is for good (or neutral) characters. My NPC is an evangelist of Pelor. (If the PCs had a cleric of Pelor, it would be even more fun for me!)

I suppose I could see the argument that it is intended only for NPCs, but that seems kind of... wrong to me.

 

[dvvega]

About the Class ...

The Evangelist (IMO) is meant to be for those games that are centred around religous parties heading out to convert the heathens. Thus it would be like the movie "The Mission" where the priest is an evangelist, defending by some warrior types, and they're off to the wilderness to convert the heathens. Along the way they must overcome superstitions, magic, etc. I do not think it is a "Core" style play PrC however.


About your Power Level vs Party concern ...

For your case, if you are concerned with the party getting more levels while NPCs stagnate you might like this idea from my homebrew.

Every NPC is giving a ranking (1,2,3 ...). A rank 1 NPC gains 1 level every time the PCs do. They are gaining experience (in whatever way they do, maybe conversions give him XP) at an equivalent rate. Rival adventuring groups would be rated 1 and so forth.

Every rank beyond 1 reduces the level gain in ration ... so 2 would gain 1 level every 2 of the party, 3 would be every 3 etc.

This helps a lot if you want a childhood enemy to be the BBEG, or if you want the evil court wizard to be of reasonable power vs the PCs.

So for your evangelist, you could rank him 1 if he needs to match the party levels etc.

 

[Crothian]

if you want the class tyo have more power, boost it up then.

 

[Terath Ninir]

if you want the class tyo have more power, boost it up then.

It's not that. I can always have him have more cronies if necessary. It's just that the class seems like such a drop in power from the bard. I keep wondering if I'm missing something about it that makes up for all that it loses.

 

[saucercrab]

Have you tried posting this over on Wizards' Character Optimization board (or even doing a search there)? If you can find a positive answer anywhere, it should be there.

 

[Diirk]

I don't know if its worth taking 5 levels of it... 3 levels might not be bad tho. Bard 7/Evangelist 3, or Bard 9/Evangelist 3 (depending on how much you want inspire greatness) might not be too bad, with the rest in bard.

Bard 7/Evangelist 3 compared to Bard 10 loses a 4th level spell (assuming 18 cha) and 2 3rd level spells. It loses +1 reflex save but gains +1 will, it loses Inspire Greatness but its other bard songs are as strong. The BAB is the same, the hp the same. It gains inspire dread/hope and inflame the righteous (effectively a 4th level spell.. but su, so no spell resistance. No energy resistance either.) Skill points are the same, with a few less skills known.

So its not too bad.. depends how useful you think its songs will be in your campaign.

 

[Terath Ninir]

Have you tried posting this over on Wizards' Character Optimization board (or even doing a search there)? If you can find a positive answer anywhere, it should be there.

The WotC boards give me cooties. ~shiver~ I don't think I can do that.

I suppose that, since inflame is a 4th level spell equivalent, it is pretty decent in power. But it's just so darn WEIRD an ability for an evangelist to have. I've seen evangelist make people have fits and speak in tongues, but never be resistant to fire...

 

[Patryn of Elvenshae]

I've seen evangelist make people have fits and speak in tongues, but never be resistant to fire...

Think about it, though.

What are evangelists (well, Christian evangelists, anyway) trying to do?

Save your soul from eternal damnation in Hell.

I'd say that fire resistance is pretty topical, even amusing.