Menu
News
All News
Dungeons & Dragons
Level Up: Advanced 5th Edition
Pathfinder
Starfinder
Warhammer
2d20 System
Year Zero Engine
Industry News
Reviews
Dragon Reflections
Columns
Weekly Digests
Weekly News Digest
Freebies, Sales & Bundles
RPG Print News
RPG Crowdfunding News
Game Content
ENterplanetary DimENsions
Mythological Figures
Opinion
Worlds of Design
Peregrine's Next
RPG Evolution
Other Columns
From the Freelancing Frontline
Monster ENcyclopedia
WotC/TSR Alumni Look Back
4 Hours w/RSD (Ryan Dancey)
The Road to 3E (Jonathan Tweet)
Greenwood's Realms (Ed Greenwood)
Drawmij's TSR (Jim Ward)
Community
Forums & Topics
Forum List
Latest Posts
Forum list
*Dungeons & Dragons
Level Up: Advanced 5th Edition
D&D Older Editions
*TTRPGs General
*Pathfinder & Starfinder
EN Publishing
*Geek Talk & Media
Search forums
Chat/Discord
Resources
Wiki
Pages
Latest activity
Media
New media
New comments
Search media
Downloads
Latest reviews
Search resources
EN Publishing
Store
EN5ider
Adventures in ZEITGEIST
Awfully Cheerful Engine
What's OLD is NEW
Judge Dredd & The Worlds Of 2000AD
War of the Burning Sky
Level Up: Advanced 5E
Events & Releases
Upcoming Events
Private Events
Featured Events
Socials!
Twitch
YouTube
Facebook (EN Publishing)
Facebook (EN World)
Twitter
Instagram
TikTok
Podcast
Features
Top 5 RPGs Compiled Charts 2004-Present
Adventure Game Industry Market Research Summary (RPGs) V1.0
Ryan Dancey: Acquiring TSR
Q&A With Gary Gygax
D&D Rules FAQs
TSR, WotC, & Paizo: A Comparative History
D&D Pronunciation Guide
Million Dollar TTRPG Kickstarters
Tabletop RPG Podcast Hall of Fame
Eric Noah's Unofficial D&D 3rd Edition News
D&D in the Mainstream
D&D & RPG History
About Morrus
Log in
Register
What's new
Search
Search
Search titles only
By:
Forums & Topics
Forum List
Latest Posts
Forum list
*Dungeons & Dragons
Level Up: Advanced 5th Edition
D&D Older Editions
*TTRPGs General
*Pathfinder & Starfinder
EN Publishing
*Geek Talk & Media
Search forums
Chat/Discord
Menu
Log in
Register
Install the app
Install
The
VOIDRUNNER'S CODEX
is coming! Explore new worlds, fight oppressive empires, fend off fearsome aliens, and wield deadly psionics with this comprehensive boxed set expansion for 5E and A5E!
Community
General Tabletop Discussion
*Dungeons & Dragons
Everything We Know About The Ravenloft Book
JavaScript is disabled. For a better experience, please enable JavaScript in your browser before proceeding.
You are using an out of date browser. It may not display this or other websites correctly.
You should upgrade or use an
alternative browser
.
Reply to thread
Message
<blockquote data-quote="Bedrockgames" data-source="post: 8269565" data-attributes="member: 85555"><p>Like I said, I liked Finn. I thought a stormtrooper turning to the good was a great idea. The Force Awakens is a good example of a movie being diverse, but not having wokeness drive the whole machine (which I think is the problem with Last Jedi). The Last Jedi is a perfect example of this going off the rails, because while it is fine as a self contained story, its function is supposed to be the middle movie in a trilogy. By subverting all the things they set up in the first movie, it just didn't serve that function well (after I saw it my only thought was, well there really isn't a place for a part III here). I think if they had gone the direction of having Rey and Kylo Ren uniting, that might have led to an interesting third movie. In the end, I think we were left with a great opening film, a weird second film that is entertaining but almost more like its own movie, and a third film that was trying to steer things back into making it a cohesive three parter but failed. Again this isn't about being bigoted. Plenty of non-bigots, very liberal and progressive people are trying to tell folks they don't like wokeness, they don't like stifling and repressive the ideology is (and how punitive it is when you step out of line). They don't like how instantly people jump to calling people bigots because they dislike a change to a movie, or dislike the overtly political message that is driving a storyline. And they don't like seeing media get worse, because the stories are getting worse as the focus just seems to be 'have we checked off all the boxes'. That doesn't mean you reject diversity or are bigoted. It means you don't want movies, shows and games that feel like they were written by a woke Mr. Rogers for elementary school students. I feel extremely talked down to when I view woke-influenced media. Making these criticisms doesn't mean one agrees with bigoted trolls who just don't want a black stormtrooper. To me the problem with wokeness isn't its diversity, its its rigidity, and its sense of propriety around everything (where anything vaguely transgressive is 'icky' and 'bad', and where everything seems to get read extremely uncharitably, and through a lens that is looking for issues to complain about). It honestly reminds me of when conservatives used to get all worked up about movies, music and shows. Same kind of moral outrage. Just different moral reasoning. But it is often narrow, and often misjudges things and accuses them of being something bad, when they aren't. The fact that you take it as a sign of a bad faith argument, simply because someone says woke, that should show you how containing that paradigm is. It is possible for well intentioned things to go off the rails, and to lead to less interesting art.</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="Bedrockgames, post: 8269565, member: 85555"] Like I said, I liked Finn. I thought a stormtrooper turning to the good was a great idea. The Force Awakens is a good example of a movie being diverse, but not having wokeness drive the whole machine (which I think is the problem with Last Jedi). The Last Jedi is a perfect example of this going off the rails, because while it is fine as a self contained story, its function is supposed to be the middle movie in a trilogy. By subverting all the things they set up in the first movie, it just didn't serve that function well (after I saw it my only thought was, well there really isn't a place for a part III here). I think if they had gone the direction of having Rey and Kylo Ren uniting, that might have led to an interesting third movie. In the end, I think we were left with a great opening film, a weird second film that is entertaining but almost more like its own movie, and a third film that was trying to steer things back into making it a cohesive three parter but failed. Again this isn't about being bigoted. Plenty of non-bigots, very liberal and progressive people are trying to tell folks they don't like wokeness, they don't like stifling and repressive the ideology is (and how punitive it is when you step out of line). They don't like how instantly people jump to calling people bigots because they dislike a change to a movie, or dislike the overtly political message that is driving a storyline. And they don't like seeing media get worse, because the stories are getting worse as the focus just seems to be 'have we checked off all the boxes'. That doesn't mean you reject diversity or are bigoted. It means you don't want movies, shows and games that feel like they were written by a woke Mr. Rogers for elementary school students. I feel extremely talked down to when I view woke-influenced media. Making these criticisms doesn't mean one agrees with bigoted trolls who just don't want a black stormtrooper. To me the problem with wokeness isn't its diversity, its its rigidity, and its sense of propriety around everything (where anything vaguely transgressive is 'icky' and 'bad', and where everything seems to get read extremely uncharitably, and through a lens that is looking for issues to complain about). It honestly reminds me of when conservatives used to get all worked up about movies, music and shows. Same kind of moral outrage. Just different moral reasoning. But it is often narrow, and often misjudges things and accuses them of being something bad, when they aren't. The fact that you take it as a sign of a bad faith argument, simply because someone says woke, that should show you how containing that paradigm is. It is possible for well intentioned things to go off the rails, and to lead to less interesting art. [/QUOTE]
Insert quotes…
Verification
Post reply
Community
General Tabletop Discussion
*Dungeons & Dragons
Everything We Know About The Ravenloft Book
Top