Excerpt: The Warlord

[Riley]

And what about Shadow!

Necromancer – Shadow Leader
Illusionist – Shadow Controller

I'm guessing 2010. Which seems an awfully long time to wait.

 

[Hussar]

How many sergeants, lieutenants, captains, or majors have you heard being described as a "warlord"? Do you mean to tell me that our army contains thousands upon thousands of warlords?

My point still stands. It's like a doctor calling the muscle in your calf a "bicep" -- yes, it refers to a muscle, but it's the wrong muscle. And in English, warlord has ONE WELL-DEFINED MEANING, and ONLY ONE MEANING: "Military dictator of a region or district." So, yes, the writers are objectively wrong to replace a word that actually means what they're describing with a word that means something totally different.

At the very least, it illustrates that they don't have a dictionary on hand. Which is odd for someone who's being paid to write.

Your own definition disagrees with you. All of the sample archetypes they put up actually fit your definition of warlord - someone who commands an area either in support or defiance of the government.

Show me a fantasy campaign where you have all those military ranks and I'll show you one seriously anachronistic game.

I would point you Here as well:

Warlordism in Europe is usually connected to various mercenary companies and their chieftains, which often were de facto powerholders in the areas in which they resided. Such free companies would arise in a situation when the recognized central power had collapsed, such as in the Great Interregnum in Germany (1254-1278) or in France during the Hundred Years' War after the Battle of Poitiers.

Free company mercenary captains, such as Sir John Hawkwood, Roger de Flor of Catalan Company or Hugh Calveley could be considered as warlords. Several condottieri in Italy can also be classified as warlords.

Ygo Gales Galama was a famous Frisian warlord, and so was his descendant Pier Gerlofs Donia, who was also the leader of the legendary Arumer Black Heap. Donia's best known enemy and rival was a mercenary himself; the Count of Nychlenborch, a Burgundian-vassal. All these legendary warriors can be considered warlords.

The Imperial commanders-in-chief during the reign of Emperor Maximilian I did hold the title Kriegsherr of which the direct translation was "warlord", but they were not warlords in sense of the word defined.

Hrm, mercenary captain. Gee, how would you ever link that to a D&D group?

 

[Stalker0]

They didn't mention it, but they probably also wanted to avoid having a "martial" "marshal" thing when playing a game spoken over a table.

Yet now you have the warlock/warlord problem. In my last playtest, I accidentally called the warlock a warlord twice, and there wasn't even a warlord in the game.

 

[Mad Mac]

How many sergeants, lieutenants, captains, or majors have you heard being described as a "warlord"? Do you mean to tell me that our army contains thousands upon thousands of warlords?

We're talking about a fantasy game here, not a modern army. Noble-born Knight-commanders, Tribal Cheiftans, Elven Marchwardens and Mercenary Captains who are in nominal allegiance to the national government or in defiance of it, are a better fit for fantasy games and feudal systems than structured, professional armies.

Besides, Marshall isn't really an improvement on that score. How many Sergeants, Lieutenants, Captains, Majors, Generals, Admirals, Knights, Grenadiers, Barbarian Cheiftans, Mercenary Captains and Bandit leaders have your heard being described as "Marshalls"?

And in English, warlord has ONE WELL-DEFINED MEANING, and ONLY ONE MEANING: "Military dictator of a region or district."

This is somewhat at odds with your posted dictionary definition.

 

[Baka no Hentai]

They didn't mention it, but they probably also wanted to avoid having a "martial" "marshal" thing when playing a game spoken over a table.

Although now Jan Brady's "Martial Marshal Marsha!" line actually makes sense.

That Brady Bunch... I always knew they were ahead of their time...

 

[WyzardWhately]

I don't remember anyone else climbing out on this limb, so I am gonna claim to be the first. I am betting that everyone will get to choose a number of skills from the non-class list equal to their int bonus. I just can't see a 1st level warlord with only 4 trained skills. This may help to keep INT from being a total dump stat for some classes.

The sample characters would seem to falsify that idea. Sadly, IMHO, because I don't see INT doing as much as I'd like it to.

 

[Lacyon]

We're talking about a fantasy game here, not a modern army. Noble-born Knight-commanders, Tribal Cheiftans, Elven Marchwardens and Mercenary Captains who are in nominal allegiance to the national government or in defiance of it, are a better fit for fantasy games and feudal systems than structured, professional armies.

The phrase in the warlord definition that causes problems "exercising civil power". Most mercenary captains, marchwardens, and knight-commanders don't do this.

Of course, this isn't a problem if you keep searching for other definitions. For example, at dictionary.com:

1. a military leader, esp. of a warlike nation.

or, further down:

warlord noun
a very powerful military leader

Both of which fit the concept of 'martial leader' role pretty well.

 

[Ulthwithian]

I'm pretty sure that CarnivorousBean is speaking of the term 'warlord' from a historical perspective. In my studies of Chinese history, the early 1900s are generally referred to as the 'Age of Warlords' or 'Warlordism'. There is a definite connotation to the word when used in historical or political circles that gives it a very unsavory edge. 'Warlords', in that context, are the military equivalent of late 1800s American 'capitalists' (i.e., robber barons, by and large).

However.

The term Warlord is an easy word to break down. It is someone who is either 1) A Lord of War, or 2) A Lord by War. 4E Warlords are pretty clearly the first example, while CarnivorousBean is using the second example; i.e., a tyrant, in the purest sense of the term.

The alternative was 'Marshal'. That is, 'One who Marshals (an army)'. WotC apparently did not take this since there is a clearly defined if rather unused Military Rank, the Field Marshal, that might imply more than WotC cared to imply with the term.

Neither are perfect (personally, I would have preferred something akin to Warmaster). Both imply a scale beyond that normally encountered in an RPG, for example. However, both directly convey the important aspect of the class.

I wouldn't have minded if the class was called the Marshal, but I feel Warlord is more evocative. Unfortunately, exactly what that word evokes for some people may not be to their taste.

 

[Steely Dan]

I'm guessing 2010.

But I want an oompa loompa now!

 

[Sir Brennen]

Neither are perfect (personally, I would have preferred something akin to Warmaster).

Except the first thing my brain did was flip that around to read "Warhamster".

C'mon. It's not just me, is it?