Extra Spell Feat = Extra Confusing [2006 Thread]

[Thanee]

...the mechanics differ slightly.

Yep, one allows picking from other lists, the other not.

Bye
Thanee

 

[Dannyalcatraz]

Well, color me corrected.

Me
Re: Extra Spell:
A few questions about the Extra Spell Feat:

1) From what spell lists may a spell be learned with the Extra Spell feat? Could a wizard use this feat to learn a druid spell?

2) If a caster learned a spell by this feat, does that mean that the caster can cast the spell?

3) Can he cast the spell even if the spell is not on the PC's class spell lists (such as if a wizard used the feat to learn a druid spell)?

WisCustServ
Re: Extra Spell:

Wizards may only choose spells from the Wizard spell list. Remember that the only spells a wizard can always choose from normally are the spells in the Player's Handbook. Technically, unless the DM freely allows spells from other sourcebooks and campaign settings to be chosen, the wizard would use Extra Spell to choose a spell not normally existing in the campaign setting the DM is running.

I strongly disagree, of course- after all, in the DMG under Creating New Spells (p35), a wizard could simply "research" or "create" a spell that is not on the PHB list, without burning a feat.

<sigh> I'll talk to my group about this. In all likelyhood, we'll either keep playing it the "any" spell way or dump the feat as essentially useless.

 

[Thanee]

I strongly disagree, of course- after all, in the DMG under Creating New Spells (p35), a wizard could simply "research" or "create" a spell that is not on the PHB list, without burning a feat.

Yeah, that part of the answer is just crap. Especially the 'well, the DM doesn't allow that spell, but see I can still learn it! Wheeee!'.

<sigh> I'll talk to my group about this. In all likelyhood, we'll either keep playing it the "any" spell way or dump the feat as essentially useless.

Don't you have spontaneous casters in your game?

Bye
Thanee

 

[Dannyalcatraz]

Yeah, that part of the answer is just crap. Especially the 'well, the DM doesn't allow that spell, but see I can still learn it! Wheeee!'.

Like any DM who outlawed a spell would allow it because a PC burned a feat! HA!

And, BTW, that was the ENTIRETY of the response, but for the polite stuff (y'know "Hi" & "Bye!" stuff).

Don't you have spontaneous casters in your game?

Only one sorcerer, and since 3 of the 5 last campaigns were Core + Completes*, it doesn't look like we'll get to many.

*Those DMs use the spells, feats and PrCls, but the additional base classes aren't allowed. Nor, for that matter, are psionics and Paladins.

 

[Hypersmurf]

Yeah, that part of the answer is just crap. Especially the 'well, the DM doesn't allow that spell, but see I can still learn it! Wheeee!'.

There is a space in between "This spell is available" and "This spell is banned".

There are DMs about who have core spells freely available, and non-core spells exist, but are not able to be picked up as easily.

Divine casters can prepare any spell from the core list, or non-core spells they have been exposed to. Wizards can gain two free spells each level from the core list, but non-core spells must be learned from scrolls or spellbooks that contain them. With these DMs, the existence of a non-core spell in a splatbook might mean it exists in the campaign world, but doesn't automatically mean the PCs can have it, until they find it in-game.

Perhaps a wizard might research such a spell... but that presumes he has the time, the money, and the laboratory available. A wizard gaining 9th level somewhere in the middle of the Crater Ridge Mines might spend a feat for a badly-needed non-core spell, because he knows that his opportunity to research it will not come until he's dead, otherwise.

-Hyp.

 

[Dannyalcatraz]

IME, H-Smurf, DMs who restrict spell access thus would either allow the research to occur in a timely fashion without burning the feat, would have an adventure planned to learn the spell without burning the feat, etc.

 

[dagger]

After reading all the threads and talking it over with my fellow gamers. I would probably only allow spells not on default spell lists on a case by case basis.

 

[Thanee]

There is a space in between "This spell is available" and "This spell is banned".

No, there are two!

Bye
Thanee

 

[Hypersmurf]

IME, H-Smurf, DMs who restrict spell access thus would either allow the research to occur in a timely fashion without burning the feat, would have an adventure planned to learn the spell without burning the feat, etc.

If I were restricting spells in such a fashion, I'd assume most of them would enter the campaign through captured scrolls or spellbooks rather than research; transcribing a spell takes a day, research takes weeks. And particularly in certain styles of campaign, time pressure can make 'weeks' impractical. Under these circumstances, where the time is unavailable, the wizard lacks access to the spell, and is unable to research it.

But I would certainly consider (possibly on a spell-by-spell basis) allowing the feat to grant such a spell immediately, much as the two free spells per level are granted immediately.

-Hyp.

 

[videogamer247]

What about warmages? To them, they know all the spells on their spell list and can cast them. Electic learning lets them pull spells that are normally outside their spell list, so I don't see why other classes wouldn't be able to do the same with this feat. If what's been said above that the caster can learn it but not necessarily cast it, then wouldn't it be completely useless to a warmage? The PHB doesn't say waht you can't put in your spell book (for wizards), however, it does say that a wizard can prepare any spell in his spell book. That being the case, there is also the fact that in the PHB it says that you can also reasearch spells to create a new one or duplicate an existing spell (page 179 of the PHB 3.5). So, coulnd't you just reasearch the arcane version of a heal spell? If so, the extra spell feat should do something to a similar effect, no?

I'm not saying that I know the answer, cause I don't, I'm just saying that perhaps you can learn divine spells with this feat. After all, there ARE arcane versions of the cure spells with bards so I see why not with Wizards and sorcerers

edit//where in the PHB does it say that wizards can only cast spells on the wizards/sorcerers spell list? and PHB page 54 it says that sorcerers can cast any spell he knows at any time. I think having a spell learned is synonymous with knowing the spell