Fafhrd and the Grey Mouser

[jester47]

I was thinking that it would be fun to slip these two into the background in the game somewhere.

Aaron.

 

[jester47]

I think these characters are so hard to stat because they are largely different in each story they are presented in.

The mouser's magic is dark andhe ussually doe not like to use it. I think he had some powerful aid when he cast the spell against the duke.

As for Fafhrd, I would say that he may not need the bard levels, and simply has a high perform skill. I am not even sure if he completed his skald training...

So as classes go, I would give Mouser a level of wizard, lots of rogue, and some as a fighter. For Fafhrd, I would make it a little rogue, and ranger, andsome fighter.

Thats bout it.

Aaron.

 

[Plane Sailing]

if you want to look at the origin of the thief class. pick up Supplement I Greyhawk.

No need, I already have it. That is what I was referring to when I wrote my original post

 

[Steverooo]

For them as cares, Fafhrd & The Grey Mouser were completely statted out in the original Deities and Demigods for 1e (the one with the Melnibonean & Nehwonian Mythoi).

Fafhrd (Hero):

AC: 2 (18, in 3e)
Move: 12 (30, in 3e)
HP: 120
Size: M (6' 11")
Alignment: NG

15th level Ranger, 13th level Thief, 5th level Bard (but remember that he's 1e, so this only makes him 15th level. Also, since this book predates Unearthed Arcana, there WAS no Barbarian class, at this pont!)

STR: 18/00 (+3/+6) INT: 17 WIS: 14 DEX: 18 CON: 18 CHA: 17

Notes: Speaks/Reads/Writes all the major languages of Nehwon, and has an 80% chance to understand any esoteric ones (High Decipher Script, in 3e).

Graywand is a Bastard Sword. Heartseeker is more a poiniard or shortsword. He also sometimes uses a handaxe balanced for throwing, and a longbow (Masterwork Mighty Composite, in 3e).

He gets +20% Climb & Hide over the 1e base (no reason given).

The Grey Mouser (Hero):

AC: 2 (18 in 3e)
Move: 12 (30 in 3e)
HP: 96
Size: M (5' 3")
Alignment: Neutral

11th level Fighter, 3rd level Magic User, 15th level Thief (but, again, in 1e he is only 15th level)!

STR: 16 (+0/+1) INT: 18 WIS: 14 DEX: 19 CON: 17 CHA: 18

Notes: Scalpel is a rapier, and Cat's Claw a dagger balanced for throwing.

ALSO, T$R put out a whole series of Lankhmar books, way back in the day, including much of the info posted in AFGNCAAP's post, above. The only one I ever bought was the first one, Lankhmar, City of Adventure. Naturally, this book lists completely different stats for the heroes!

Fafhrd:

Ranger 15/Thief 5/Bard 5 at his peak,
R 10/T 3/B 4 at maturity,
R5/T1/B3 as a youth.

Alignment still NG
STR 18/75 (+2/+3)
INT 15
WIS 10
DEX 17
CON 19
CHA 17
AC 6 (14 in 3e)
HPL 130 Peak, 110 Mature, 60 Youth

Leather armor, bastard sword, dagger (as opposed to shortsword). He is still mentioned as sometimes using a handaxe of longbow, but also a BATTLEAXE balanced for throwing! He is said to climb as a 15th level 1e Thief, with no negative modifiers for snow/ice. +3 on saves vs cold.

The Grey Mouser:

Fighter 10/Thief 15/Magic User 3 at peak,
F6/T10/MU3 when mature,
F3/T5/MU3 at youth.

Alignment: Neutral

STR 15
INT 16
WIS 11
DEX 19
CON 17
CHA 17
AC:4 (16 in 3e)
HP: 90 Peak/70 Mature/35 Youth

Leather armor, rapier, dagger balanced for throwing. +3 to hit with any rapier he has had for over two weeks (Weapon Focus & Specialization?). He is extremely streetwise (especially in Lankhmar - high Knowledge (Local), and gets +2 to Gather Information, Bargain, and deal with the bureaucracy, there).

SO! Take yer pick! Personally, I find the latter set of stats a bit better, as the WISs are lower...

 

[Greybar]

Just a quick note - my last post was rushed (silly me, ENWorlding at work ) and sounds much more abrupt than I intended upon rereading. So apologies if it seemed harsh.

Anyway, this thread sent me looking at Lankhmar sets on eBay - there are quite a few and for cheap. I'll have to look at the online resources mentioned about too.

For what it's worth, last night I got to the point in the sixth book where Fafhrd and the Grey Mouser go to recruit 12 men each like themselves. Fafhrd goes to find men he terms "beserks" (actually a slightly variant spelling of that which I cannot remember). The Mouser goes to find what he described as "swordsman-thieves" or "fighter-thieves".

john

 

[Steverooo]

Fafhrd goes to find men he terms "beserks" (actually a slightly variant spelling of that which I cannot remember).

Berserkers?

 

[AFGNCAAP]

I was thinking that it would be fun to slip these two into the background in the game somewhere.

Aaron.

Well, in that case, I think it'd be relatively easy to do so, and if they're in a magic-rich environment, then you could feasibly leave the classes as is, & not worry about reworking them to lack spellcasting ability. Other than the "amped-up" versions of the Twain found in the 1st/2nd ed. AD&D Deities & Demigods/Legends & Lore, Fafhrd's Wisdom score would be too low for him to cast ranger spells, & he could simply opt never to use any of his bard spells (or be unfamiliar to do so).

Mouser would be a rogue/wizard/fighter--he'd never exceed 3rd level as a wizard, & couldn't cast spells due to the lack of a spellbook. If you allow the swashbuckler class from Complete Warrior, then he'd have levels in that class instead of fighter. After reading over the duelist class a lot, I'd say Mouser wouldn't have levels in that class--the significant abilities work only with no armor, and when only wielding a rapier in one hand (thus no 2-weapon fighting). Mouser seemed to be the most prone of the Twain to use 2 weapons while fighting.

I think these characters are so hard to stat because they are largely different in each story they are presented in.

The mouser's magic is dark andhe ussually doe not like to use it. I think he had some powerful aid when he cast the spell against the duke.

As for Fafhrd, I would say that he may not need the bard levels, and simply has a high perform skill. I am not even sure if he completed his skald training...

So as classes go, I would give Mouser a level of wizard, lots of rogue, and some as a fighter. For Fafhrd, I would make it a little rogue, and ranger, andsome fighter.

Thats bout it.

Aaron.

With Duke Danius, Mouser had help from Ivrian, who wore her mother's clothing (Ivrian's mother/Danius's wife was a cruel, domineering woman who Danius still feared after death), so Ivrian's help & Mouser's magic undid the duke.

As for Fafhrd, I think he'd still have bard levels, but not as many as depicted in earlier versions--maybe only 1st level, or up to 3rd at most, but not the 5-6 levels assigned to him earlier. He could work a crowd, but not to the spell-like effects that a higher-level bard could.

And the characters are different from story to story--I think Fafhrd's eye color has changed (from blue to green, IIRC), and his hair has been described as red & reddish-blond. Mouser's sword also seems to be a rapier, but at times, the description is more apt for a sort of light saber (as are quite a few illustrations of the Mouser with his weapon).

For what it's worth, last night I got to the point in the sixth book where Fafhrd and the Grey Mouser go to recruit 12 men each like themselves. Fafhrd goes to find men he terms "beserks" (actually a slightly variant spelling of that which I cannot remember). The Mouser goes to find what he described as "swordsman-thieves" or "fighter-thieves".

Had my Lankhmar sourcebooks w/ me, & they have a handy little synopsis for each of the stories (up to Knight & Knave of Swords). Mouser obtained 12 fighter-thieves to sail with him to Rime Isle on his ship Flotsam; Fafhrd gathered 12 berserkers to sail with him on the ship Seahawk. Mouser sailed on Seahawk when he was returning to Rime Isle after a trade trip in "The Mer She."

This thread (as well as recent acquisition of CW) has got me working on my Lankhmar conversion again. If anyone is interested, I'll post what I have in this thread, or in a relevant (& related) Rogue's Gallery Thread. It'll take me a while, though--there are quite a few feats that I think are applicable for the characters, but there's only so many that a character can have.

If you want, I could work up a Lankhmar-style version of the Twain (setting-intensive versions of races & classes & all), as well as a mainstream D&D-version of the duo (with magic-using versions of classes & all--even magic item recommendations).