Failed promises

[Man-thing]

Although it may not be popular to say so my most recent disappointment is The Wurst of Grimtooth's Traps. It probably my fault and not Necromancers but I just wasn't impressed by this product.

I think it's a case of my expectations for the product being out of line with what the product was promised to be. I expected more new traps and not just updates of the old ones and I expected they would update the art instead of using the old graphics from the Flying Buffalo releases.

I also noticed a couple of statblock errors that I wouldn't expect from NG.

I expected that I would feel some sort of rejuvenated happiest when I got it. Like Tome of Horrors evoked but it doesn't.

 

[eyebeams]

I totally forgot about Gamma World D20. Just once I wish the writers of new eiditons of D20 would just listen to the fans and give us what we want for a change. In both the D20 and the Alternity editions the fans clamored for a return to the "wahoo" style of play with mutant animals, mutant plants, and over-the-top action. Alternity gave us a very toned down version, but at least gave us mutant animals in a Dragon Article. The D20 version gave us nanites...great. I'm so sick of writers giving us their vision of what GW should be like, and give us the version that we want.

I'm calm now...and off the soapbox...

Kane

If you have a detailed idea of exactly what you want, why, pray tell, can't you do it yourself?

 

[Arashi Ravenblade]

Kingdoms of Kalamar (i convinced a friend to buy this heap of crap off of me, though the players guide was pretty good)

Savage Species (In my opinion the worst D&D product ive ever seen)

Mutants and Masterminds (i have to seriously house rule it for me and my comic geek friends to be even remotly satisfied with it)

Champions of Ruin (wasnt horrible but yeah the monsters where pretty weak)

Everquest (just boring)

Warcraft (again boring, I didnt feel like Warcraft)

Hero Builders guide (what the heck was this crap, good thing i rented it from the library)

 

[Arnwyn]

Well, people, what books have you bought because they sounded way cool, but - when you finally read them - failed to deliver?

Well, with this premise, only a couple books meets that criteria for me:
- Epic Level Handbook
- Magic of Faerun
- Book of Hallowed Might
- Libris Mortis
- Encyclopedia of Demons & Devils (FFE)

Otherwise, though, I make sure I do my research first (especially due to that FFE book...).

(Now, there have been a few books that I bought and considered 'not very good' - but I wasn't expecting them to be all that great anyways. This included Champions of Ruin, BoED, Faiths & Pantheons, and more.)

That's a somewhat hyperbolic way of putting it, but suffice to say, if you don't think PC's should ever be doing anything of significance, go ahead and make sure they know that up front so they'll decide for themselves if your campaign is a waste of their time.

You've been strawman-ing it up pretty badly in your defense of CoR, but this is the worst. In any case, I don't think anyone was saying any of the above. In my view, they're just saying "put the EEEs' CRs at an appropriate level that meshes with all previous information on them and makes sense in the context of the campaign world, please". Then the PCs can go out and do the appropriate heroic thing.

 

[S'mon]

Off-topic, but you might like "Legends of Excalibur: Arthurian Adventures" by RPGObjects. Instead of modifying Arthur's setting to fit the rules, they modify the rules to fit the setting.

Hmm... now I'm wondering if this was the book I heard about & I bought the wrong one. :\

 

[Mokona]

Ghostwalk was the worst product but it was a bad concept to begin with so it isn't technically a failed "promise".

Savage Species on the other hand could use a serious redesign so that Monster PCs are playable without being hamstrung compared to even basic humans.

Arcana Unearthed has too many silly races.

 

[Arashi Ravenblade]

I forgot Engel, i thought it was really cool until I found out the secret of the Engel. ( im going to try and convert it to storyteller and use it as a basis for angels in World of Darkness, i didnt really like the Time of Judgements take on angels)

Urban Arcana for d20 modern was pretty bad, the setting's they have are horrible. I might as well stick with WOD (old one) for my modern gaming.

 

[Felon]

You've been strawman-ing it up pretty badly in your defense of CoR, but this is the worst.

Ahhh, you're full of it. If one side makes vague generalizations, then don't get on the other side's case for drawing inferrences in their rebuttals. I didn't get one response that actually explained how characters who've reached epic level are supposed to accomplish anything of epic significance while staying in sync with the extremely-flawed "if it's really important, a god or Elminster will handle it" logic. In fact, most replies asserted with confidence that twenty-something level characters are still just bit players and shouldn't be saving the world.

They actually affirmed my assessment of their position, they just didn't see what's wrong with it.

In any case, I don't think anyone was saying any of the above. In my view, they're just saying "put the EEEs' CRs at an appropriate level that meshes with all previous information on them and makes sense in the context of the campaign world, please". Then the PCs can go out and do the appropriate heroic thing.

So, once the PC's get around 70th-level--a level that can pretty handily be considered unattainable--then they can go fight the World-Serpent? Sorry to be all straw-manny there, but this a pretty good example of what I'm talking about. You don't state what you think an appropriate CR range is for the 3TE's, or what "makes sense in context of the campaign world" so I have to guess at what you mean. If gods are concerned about them, do they have to be powerful enough to slay the entire pantheon?

 

[ColonelHardisson]

The previously mentioned Dragonlords of Melnibone is the reigning champion for me (and will likley hold the title for eternity...I don't really buy stuff sight-unseen anymore)

I have to admit that I am now embarassed that I gave it a good review. I try to look at it in context; it was a very early d20 effort by a major RPG company, and I still don't think it's as awful as it's made out to be. The biggest disappointment that stems from DLoM is that Chaosium almost certainly will never do a revamp of it. Given the financial and critical success of recent licensed products like The Black Company, Babylon 5, and Conan, I think it's clear that the potential is there for an Elric d20 product to do well. Heck, Chaosium's own Call of Cthulhu d20 is more than enough evidence.

As for my own nominee for biggest failed promise, I'd have to say the Epic Level handbook is my choice. The designers erred on the side of being safe, and sacrificed a lot of potential for fun.

 

[Crothian]

I forgot Engel, i thought it was really cool until I found out the secret of the Engel.

What's the secret??