Failed promises

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Kanegrundar said:
So, you can tell a book you'll like from a book you won't just by thumbing through it at your FLGS? That's great, you're much better than I am. There are many books that I thought I was going to like while I was standing by the rack at the shop and then got home and tried to use them and found out how horrible they were. I don't like the book, but the publisher and designers got my money anyway. Therefore, the only way they would know about my dislike of the book is if I said something about it.

Kane

I borrow books I'm not sure about and give them a thorough read-through.

Do you really believe that the industry is responsible for poor consumer choices? It ain't. You are responsible for how you choose to spend your money. Nobody else is.
 

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Well, you have thousands of market research firms and successful companies disagreeing with you. And rightfully so.

Really? There are thousands companies that believe that the fact that they can't move a product is irrelevant to whether or not it's meeting the needs of consumers?

Actually, in gaming, I'm sure there are. That's one of the problems with the whole industry.
 

Erik Mona said:
And yet Omega World, which celebrated Gamma World's quirkiness and reveled in the goofiness of the original game, was the most popular Polyhedron Mini-Game out of about 15.

Go figure.

--Erik Mona

Which of the other games were based on an old TSR offering that would be remembered by the aging segment you serve, Erik?
 

eyebeams said:
I borrow books I'm not sure about and give them a thorough read-through.

Do you really believe that the industry is responsible for poor consumer choices? It ain't. You are responsible for how you choose to spend your money. Nobody else is.
I'm the only guy in my group that buys the books, so borrowing isn't an option for me.

Where did I ever say that the industry is responsible for my buying choices? I was just following up your comment about telling the publishers what I think of their product by not buying it.

Have you never complained about a book? You can borrow a copy of any book that you're interested in? If that's the case, I'd say you're a LOT luckier than just about anyone else on the boards.

Most of the time I can sniff out the crap before I buy it, but sometimes a crappy book slips through. When it does, I will tell others about it to maybe help save them a few bucks. That's what I do with the new GWPHB. I just can't see how telling others about subpar product is worth all this complaining on your part.

Kane
 

The Deep and Hunt: Rise of Evil. I like most of MEG's stuff (the Foul Locals are excellent), but editing in the Deep sucks big time and H:ROE to puts me to sleep.

Sorcery & Steam (FFG) was not what I was looking for. The rules on making devices are almost a skeleton and the PRCs are for a Victorian setting. The only good part is the intro.

Cityworks would be much better if the section on fantasy cities was more than caves, tree tops and cliff dwellings.

Warcraft- I like WC3 a lot, but the book was just meh for me.

RPGObject's Carthage pdf dissapointed me big time. No maps, a simple overview of the city state, a class I really don't want and not giving Hannibal ranks in Knowledge (tactics) all point to a poor product.

The Center Space from Frught Lupes- it looks interesting, but the background makes printing impossible for some reason. I will read short pdfs, but not one 301 pages long.

13 Nanoaugmentors (Ronin Arts)- most of the 13 are rather old concepts of cyber gear.

Top Fashion's pdfs on books and alchemical items. A list of one or two sentance descriptions is not what I wanted.

Masque of the Red Death. The new material compaired to the box set is minimal and not worth 25 or 30 bucks.

The Gamma World PH. I bought all the GW books to convert back to Alternity and the only thing in the PH that stands out is the community rules.

Midnight. I knew it was going to be depressing, but I thought there would be some way to win.

Darwin's World 1st ed. and the critter book. More depressing than Midnight and I don't like desert post apocolyptic games anyways. The creatures are mostly stupid.
 


Kae'Yoss said:
Good for you. I doubt that this option is open to everyone, though.

If you don't know anybody else who regularly buys gaming books, it would seem to me that you either have rather . . . exessively frugal . . . gamer friends or you just don't have other gamers around. If the former, then they're kind of sponging off you. If the latter, how can you game in the first place? I think it's fair to presuppose that gamers actually know other gamers who aren't total skinflints.
 

I'm the only guy in my group that buys the books, so borrowing isn't an option for me.

Sounds like a kind of cheap group. If you're bearing the entire economic load for your group, then you have to ask whether the hobby is worth it, really. No marketing/production strategy can compensate for socially dysfunctional relationships. And "We all play, but I spend all the money," is a problem in of itself, not an excuse.

Where did I ever say that the industry is responsible for my buying choices? I was just following up your comment about telling the publishers what I think of their product by not buying it.

Have you never complained about a book? You can borrow a copy of any book that you're interested in? If that's the case, I'd say you're a LOT luckier than just about anyone else on the boards.

I've disliked books. I've never (as far as I can recall -- there may have been indiscretions when I was younger) complained about a book as if I was entitled to particular content. Neither of us are entitled to squat. Stop pretending that designers are duty bound to cater to your specific tastes and accept that as a consumer, it's *your* job to ensure that your tastes are compatible with the product you plan to buy.

Most of the time I can sniff out the crap before I buy it, but sometimes a crappy book slips through. When it does, I will tell others about it to maybe help save them a few bucks. That's what I do with the new GWPHB. I just can't see how telling others about subpar product is worth all this complaining on your part.

Because the detail you spent on your comments indicated that you never needed to buy it in the first place to get the game you wanted.
 

eyebeams said:
If you don't know anybody else who regularly buys gaming books, it would seem to me that you either have rather . . . exessively frugal . . . gamer friends or you just don't have other gamers around. If the former, then they're kind of sponging off you. If the latter, how can you game in the first place? I think it's fair to presuppose that gamers actually know other gamers who aren't total skinflints.

That doesn't work for several reasons:

There are indeed not that many players around, at least not enough I know well enough to burrow a book.

I'm occasionally interested in stuff others don't want/need, so I cannot borrow that stuff, either.

I want to read through my books myself before I even consider lending them to someone else, and I suspect that others are the same. I also don't want to give a book away for weeks until they have read the whole thing (people do have other things to do), and expect others to be the same.

So if you know a lot of people who no only buy stuff blindly - stuff you want, no less - and are nice enough to let you borrow it and read the whole thing, that's nice. But it's not like that here, and I dare saying that it is not the norm, either.
 

eyebeams said:
Really? There are thousands companies that believe that the fact that they can't move a product is irrelevant to whether or not it's meeting the needs of consumers?
Well, not quite. Or, rather, not just. Absolutely, sales is an important indicator. But market research is there because companies wants to know specifically why.
Actually, in gaming, I'm sure there are. That's one of the problems with the whole industry.
:lol:
 

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