Familiars: are they worth it?
- Thread starter nikolai
- Start date
Saeviomagy
Adventurer
There are two types of DM's, and hence two tactics to take with familiars.
1) The DM pays attention to the familiar and allows it to participate - familiars get spot checks, can use scent, are comfortable in areas where their master would be comfortable etc.
2) The DM is a prig. The familiar is generally assumed to have no mind of its own. Usually the DM will dispute whether the familiar can think coherently enough for empathic communication to give any information whatsoever. A flying familiar will generally be unable to fly in whatever environment you are currently in (even if it's a bat, and you're in a cave). Certainly, if the familiar can fly, it can't give back any information. A bat familiar will want to be asleep all the time. Any familiar on a scouting mission will typically be rapidly spotted - the DM will assume that the animal simply walks out in front of obvious enemies.
In scenario 1), a familiar is a fun, useful addition to the wizard's reportoire. In scenario 2), it's a bit of dead weight with a skill bonus attached.
1) The DM pays attention to the familiar and allows it to participate - familiars get spot checks, can use scent, are comfortable in areas where their master would be comfortable etc.
2) The DM is a prig. The familiar is generally assumed to have no mind of its own. Usually the DM will dispute whether the familiar can think coherently enough for empathic communication to give any information whatsoever. A flying familiar will generally be unable to fly in whatever environment you are currently in (even if it's a bat, and you're in a cave). Certainly, if the familiar can fly, it can't give back any information. A bat familiar will want to be asleep all the time. Any familiar on a scouting mission will typically be rapidly spotted - the DM will assume that the animal simply walks out in front of obvious enemies.
In scenario 1), a familiar is a fun, useful addition to the wizard's reportoire. In scenario 2), it's a bit of dead weight with a skill bonus attached.
Tessarael
Adventurer
Familiars sharing skills is great for a Rogue/Wizard. I'm still in two minds about familiar survivability.
My Fighter 4/Rogue 4/Spymaster 10/Wizard 1 has a diminutive owl familiar. She's great at hiding and moving silently - I'm slightly better due to skill items, but still those racial bonuses of the owl are nice. Most of the time, she's hiding in a familiar pocket. When scouting, the owl will come out when I need to cover two locations at once, or over an extended period of time. e.g. In a stakeout, I can't be awake all of the time. Other than that, yeah I figure she'll be good for doing skill assist once we can communicate with a language.
And yeah, at this level a Horrid Wilting can kill the familiar in one round. Hence why hiding in the Familiar Pocket whenever danger might be around.
My Fighter 4/Rogue 4/Spymaster 10/Wizard 1 has a diminutive owl familiar. She's great at hiding and moving silently - I'm slightly better due to skill items, but still those racial bonuses of the owl are nice. Most of the time, she's hiding in a familiar pocket. When scouting, the owl will come out when I need to cover two locations at once, or over an extended period of time. e.g. In a stakeout, I can't be awake all of the time. Other than that, yeah I figure she'll be good for doing skill assist once we can communicate with a language.
And yeah, at this level a Horrid Wilting can kill the familiar in one round. Hence why hiding in the Familiar Pocket whenever danger might be around.
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TheAuldGrump
First Post
And sometimes the player thinks that the familiar is somehow invulnerable...
'Ummm, let's get this straight... you cast Endure Elements on your raven?'
'Yup!'
'And have it fly through the cinder flume of an erupting volcano?'
'Yup!'
'You are aware that the spell is first level right?'
'Yup!'
'And that as a result your familiar will end up dead in the first round?'
'Why do you think that?'
'Read the spell description.'
'Oh...'
It is thinking like that that makes me wish that the roll eyes smiley was still around. I usually manage to bounce what they just said back at them in such a way that they realize that they are trying to kill off their tiny friends... but sometimes they insist.
And then there was the player who thought that his barbarian eating the wizard's familiar was a great running gag... Then wondered why his allignment was sliding toward chaotic evil. (The wizard in question in no way deserved what the barbarian was doing... the nitwit just thought that draining xp from the wizard on a semi regular basis was funny.)
The Auld Grump, I finally just had to come right out and tell the player, if you don't stop eating the wizard's familiar I will kill your character off. He ignored anything else, including just telling him as DM to stop it.
'Ummm, let's get this straight... you cast Endure Elements on your raven?'
'Yup!'
'And have it fly through the cinder flume of an erupting volcano?'
'Yup!'
'You are aware that the spell is first level right?'
'Yup!'
'And that as a result your familiar will end up dead in the first round?'
'Why do you think that?'
'Read the spell description.'
'Oh...'
It is thinking like that that makes me wish that the roll eyes smiley was still around. I usually manage to bounce what they just said back at them in such a way that they realize that they are trying to kill off their tiny friends... but sometimes they insist.
And then there was the player who thought that his barbarian eating the wizard's familiar was a great running gag... Then wondered why his allignment was sliding toward chaotic evil. (The wizard in question in no way deserved what the barbarian was doing... the nitwit just thought that draining xp from the wizard on a semi regular basis was funny.)
The Auld Grump, I finally just had to come right out and tell the player, if you don't stop eating the wizard's familiar I will kill your character off. He ignored anything else, including just telling him as DM to stop it.
I'm A Banana
Potassium-Rich
Some of my players are into the 'cute kitty' factor.
Others see it as a target. I've never been too mean to 'em (only stolen a spellbook once for one adventure over 5 years of gaming.......), but they just don't trust me........(mwahahahaha)
Others see it as a target. I've never been too mean to 'em (only stolen a spellbook once for one adventure over 5 years of gaming.......
), but they just don't trust me........(mwahahahaha)Do they add something to the game with the people I'm with (game style, personalities of the other players etc) then yes, they are worth it.
If they do not, then no.
(the same can be said of any rule/option/etc)
The people I have gamed with ... the answer has been yes to this.
If they do not, then no.
(the same can be said of any rule/option/etc)
The people I have gamed with ... the answer has been yes to this.
Brekki
First Post
Familiars are great !!
I have a wizard / loremaster (and some other classes) with maximized use magic device.
My familiar is a celestial earth elemental .... used to be a normal animal untill I cast the elemental familiar and celestial familiar spells from the WotC spellbook archive.
So now, with help of the familiar pocket ... as a free action I get him from the pocket, he fires a fireball or whatever from a wand, and as a free action he again re-enters the familiar pocket
... no harm ever comes to him, he's very annoying, but not harmfull enough to be a true threat ... just enough to count in battles and finally get some use out of all the wands / staffs we have but never use.
I have a wizard / loremaster (and some other classes) with maximized use magic device.
My familiar is a celestial earth elemental .... used to be a normal animal untill I cast the elemental familiar and celestial familiar spells from the WotC spellbook archive.
So now, with help of the familiar pocket ... as a free action I get him from the pocket, he fires a fireball or whatever from a wand, and as a free action he again re-enters the familiar pocket
... no harm ever comes to him, he's very annoying, but not harmfull enough to be a true threat ... just enough to count in battles and finally get some use out of all the wands / staffs we have but never use.
Herpes Cineplex
First Post
Yeah, that's rough. It's that kind of thing that led us to just establish a house rule that if your familiar is sharing the same 5' space as you, it only has to make a save if you failed yours; otherwise, just ignore any damage it might have taken. Or, more commonly, we assume that you told your familiar to get completely out of the area of the fight immediately and that none of the bad guys are ever going to waste their time chasing it down.Tessarael said:
Which is clearly against the rules, but since the spell familiar pocket doesn't exist in our game and familiars are mostly used as friends and assistants for peaceful situations rather than as combatants, we don't care. It just saves time and grief for everyone involved if we give the familiars a break under those circumstances.
Now, if a familiar is out spying on the bad guys and gets spotted and recognized, well...then the gloves come off. Same goes for a familiar moving around in a fight, delivering touch attacks or flanking with a bad guy; the familiar becomes a valid and attractive target, and if an area-effect spell goes off, the familiar's on its own and can very easily die. That tends to keep familiars out of fights except when the spellcaster is extraordinarily desperate, which suits our purposes.
--
we're not exactly obsessed with realism in our fantasy games
Li Shenron
Legend
In my personal experience, it is an advantage to have a familiar, but not huge.
Most of the time, the player doesn't know how to make it useful or is afraid of getting it killed: in this worst case a familiar is still worth two (lesser) feats, the one granted + Alertness, since the Wiz/Sor basically plays the familiar by just keeping it in his pocket or on his shoulder.
Otherwise, the only common use is to have the familiar scout ahead, if it can fly or if it is very unlikely to attract attention (such as a rat), but only if there is no apparent danger in doing so.
The best ability for standard familiars should be the touch spell delivery, but I haven't seen it used at all, even more powerful wizards are afraid to risk the familiar's life sending it into combat, and even prefer to go themselves into melee to cast the spell rather than face a possible Xp drain.
An improved familiar is instead another thing, and since it doesn't grant an extra feat it is actually taken with the purpose of using it
Most of the time, the player doesn't know how to make it useful or is afraid of getting it killed: in this worst case a familiar is still worth two (lesser) feats, the one granted + Alertness, since the Wiz/Sor basically plays the familiar by just keeping it in his pocket or on his shoulder.
Otherwise, the only common use is to have the familiar scout ahead, if it can fly or if it is very unlikely to attract attention (such as a rat), but only if there is no apparent danger in doing so.
The best ability for standard familiars should be the touch spell delivery, but I haven't seen it used at all, even more powerful wizards are afraid to risk the familiar's life sending it into combat, and even prefer to go themselves into melee to cast the spell rather than face a possible Xp drain.
An improved familiar is instead another thing, and since it doesn't grant an extra feat it is actually taken with the purpose of using it
Uses for familiar
I play a Barbarian/Sorcerer (yes I know he's a broken PC) with a weasel familiar. The weasel is an excellent scout with Hide and Move Silent skills that would make a rogue jealous. He has also helped the party escape from a cell, when we were imprisoned rather than TPKed by the DM. He normally does NOT get into combat, although once served as a distraction to allow my character to get in an attack that took down a nasty opponent.
As has been mentioned in other posts, my DM does not deliberately target familiars. As a result I am willing to use him in the game, even though I can remember second edition familiars which were basically an accident waiting to happen.
Bigwilly
I play a Barbarian/Sorcerer (yes I know he's a broken PC) with a weasel familiar. The weasel is an excellent scout with Hide and Move Silent skills that would make a rogue jealous. He has also helped the party escape from a cell, when we were imprisoned rather than TPKed by the DM. He normally does NOT get into combat, although once served as a distraction to allow my character to get in an attack that took down a nasty opponent.
As has been mentioned in other posts, my DM does not deliberately target familiars. As a result I am willing to use him in the game, even though I can remember second edition familiars which were basically an accident waiting to happen.
Bigwilly
