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Message: <blockquote data-quote="DEFCON 1" data-source="post: 6109293" data-attributes="member: 7006">Actually... I think what you are seeing is the reason why some of those fighter maneuvers and some of the rogue skill uses have become feats.  They are there to be used in the Basic game (the one without selectable feats.)Here's the situation as I see it:The Basic game Core Four will have little to no options.  Everything that might've been an option will instead be a Class Feature-- basically a "pre-selected option".  The reason for this is because they have stated that the intent is that you should be able to use a Basic Core Four class in the same game as a Standard class.  In order to do that... a Basic Core Four class has to give almost the same exact amount of power as a Standard version for balance reasons.  The only difference between the two being the complexity of those Class Feature options that the Core Four class gets-- the less complex to understand but equally as powerful option as one selectable by a Standard class.So let's take the Rogue for example.  To balance a Basic Rogue (a version that seemingly will not have Backgrounds/Skills nor Specialties/Feats) against a Standard Rogue-- while at the same time making the Basic Rogue recognizeable to a BECMI/AD&D player-- you need several things:1) A Basic game equivalent to the bonuses a Standard rogue gets for having trained skills and the Skill Die.  They have mentioned that at this juncture, their idea is just giving a flat bonus to any DEX checks a Basic Rogue might get (same way a Basic Fighter gets a flat bonus to STR checks, Cleric to CHA checks, and Wizards a bonus to INT checks.)  Theoretically... that still keeps the Basic and Standard Rogues in balance when it comes to removing the idea of backgrounds and skills.2) You also need a Basic game equivalent to the Standard rogue when it comes to Feats.  A Standard rogue is getting a Feat at 1st level due to its Specialty PLUS it is getting three free feats as part of its Rogue Scheme.  Which means the Basic Rogue also needs to get FOUR "Class Features" of an equal amount of power so that the two remain in balance.Now here's where it gets interesting...*IF* you take things like Open Locks, Disarm Traps, Pickpocketing, and Climb Shear Surfaces and KEEP them in the purview of the just Skill System... so that you have a "Thievery" skill and a "Climb" skill that covers shear surfaces, and "Conceal At Object" that can be used to pickpocket... the Basic game's Rogue will never see them.  They are now a part of the game system that the Basic Rogue does not use.BUT-- by making them Feats... you are basically creating a version of the "Trained Only" use from 3rd edition.  Only those "trained" in the skills listed and (in this case, "trained" = "has the feat") would be allowed to open locks, disarm traps etc.  Those special uses of certain skills that not everybody can do.  The only difference being that rather them being listed as a segment of a skill-- which again, Basic Rogues are never going to have-- they are listed as a Feat... which a Basic Rogue is going to receive FOUR of listed as Class Features in order to remain balanced with the Standard Rogue.So when you look at a class description of a Basic Rogue, it's going to list as its Class Features the following (which comes from the game pre-selecting for you the Thief Scheme and one further feat choice):Open LocksPickpocketingClimb Shear SurfacesFind/Disarm TrapsWouldn't you know it!  Your Basic Rogue now lists as class features four of the primary "Thief Skills" a BECMI or AD&D character would also list... without actually needing the 5E skill system to use.  And on top of that... this Basic Rogue is also balanced against the Standard Rogue, who ALSO has three free feats from his Rogue Scheme, plus one other feat as per his Specialty.It's actually a rather clever way of getting recognizeable "Thief Skills" into the Basic game without actually needing to use the Background and Skills system.Is it perfect?  Eh.  But it does solve the two biggest issues when designing the Basic Rogue-- how to get him the traditional Thief Skills listed right there in the class description without using the Skill system, and how to give him Feats just like the Standard Rogue without giving him additional and complex abilities that are not mimicking those abilities a BECMI / AD&D player is expecting out of the Basic game.</blockquote>

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