Figuring out saves for monsters abilities

[gariig]

I'm just curious, how do you figure out what the DC for a monsters special abilitity is. Let's use an energy drain from the SRD. The Wight has a Fort DC14 to resist. Is it (10 + 1/2 HD + Con/Cha mod)? If it's save is a Will save does it use the creaturers Wis instead of Con/Cha? Does Reflex save depend on Dex?

Gariig

 

[pontus]

Special abilities usually have a DC of 10 + hd/2 + ability modifier

Most "physical" (poison, breath weapon, etc) use Con
Most "mystical" (energy drain, gaze, etc) use Cha

 

[gariig]

It only uses Cha and Con? What about undead, do you use the Cha modifier?

Also, what about monsters where the DC doesn't follow that rule? Do you take the given DC or the formula whichever is higher?

Gariig

 

[SpikeyFreak]

It only uses Cha and Con? What about undead, do you use the Cha modifier?

Also, what about monsters where the DC doesn't follow that rule? Do you take the given DC or the formula whichever is higher?

Gariig

Like what monster? I think that's a pretty straight forward rule that all monsters SHOULD use, and when a DC is different, it should state why.

If you want to increase or decrease the DC, you could always increase or decrease the ability score of the individual monster in question.

--De-lurking Spikey

 

[Emongnome]

See pages 7-9 in the Monster Manual for the special attack descritption: Energy drain is 10 + 1/2 HD + Cha mod. Breath weapon uses Con mod, just like pontus mentioned. Your example of a wight follows this formula: 10 +1/2 (4 HD) + (+2 Cha mod) = 14. If the DC listed in the monster description doesn't follow this formula, there is either a feat or other special ability affecting it, or just a mistake, in which case, I would always follow the formula. On a side note, if I were to play a wight using the Savage Species rules, and start taking class levels, would the DC go up since class levels add to my hit dice?

 

[Staffan]

On a side note, if I were to play a wight using the Savage Species rules, and start taking class levels, would the DC go up since class levels add to my hit dice?

I'd say no. I think "HD" in the formula is supposed to be pretty much as the "level" in (e.g.) the DC for the monk's stunning fist. Since that doesn't increase with levels in other classes, the DC for the wraith's energy drain shouldn't increase with levels outside the wraith "class".

Now, I'm not sure if the wraith can advance beyond the normal HD, but if they can *those* should definitely count toward the DC.

 

[Gez]

If the creature is alive, then:

• If it's "biological" (like a poison), use Con.
• If it's "magical" (like a fear aura), use Cha.

If the creature is undead, use Cha.

And for the record, I would tend to think that abilities that depends on HD use all HD, while abilities that depends on levels in a class use only the levels from that particular class.

By the way, the formulae (10 + half HD + Ability modifier) sometimes allow variation in special powers of Prestige Classes. I remember having seen (10 + class level + ability mod), which seems OK given that PrC levels are usually quite low.

Sidenote, on the Monk's stunning fist ability, I agree with Sean K. Reynolds.

 

[gariig]

Thank you for the help

Gariig