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Message: <blockquote data-quote="Dannyalcatraz" data-source="post: 4403886" data-attributes="member: 19675">Refuse all you want, but apparently, you missed my caveat, "Less than optimal? Perhaps, if you're not a Ranger, Fighter, OA Samurai or PsyWar, but you still have that option."Besides, it still depends upon your build & how much you want to commit to it.  I usually use a Dex & Wis build for my monks, as opposed to Str & Wis. Early on, equipped with a Quiver of Ehlonna and a bunch of javelins & alchemical bombs, they make fine artillery.  And again, you really only need the first two feats to make a difference in your ranged combat effectiveness- the rest is gravy.As the Monk levels up, he will, of course, suffer in comparison to a "warrior" class sniper.Not quite.  "Better" has nothing to do with it.I'm objecting to 4Ed's design decision that- unlike 3.X- certain starting class abilities are never available to a multiclassing PC unless he starts in that class...and the player doesn't even get to choose those abilities from which his PC will be forever barred.  A 4Ed multiclassed PC has been essentially "socially promoted"- even though he lacks some of a class' fundamental abilities, he still gets to call himself a fully qualified member of that class.In this particular, a 4Ed PC who is proficient with a ranged weapon and multiclasses into the Ranger class will never get access to a fundamental class ability.In 3.X, the abilities your PC lost out on due to multiclassing were the high-level ones.  This more accurately reflects the way people learn and earn promotions. Actually, I don't think that the amount of forethought required in PC design between the editions is that different.What does differ is..well, I mentioned it above.While you do have a point, I've pointed out in other threads that it is also perfectly valid to compare 4Ed to 3.X because that is its direct competitor in the marketplace.That said, as I recall, PBS, PS, and WFoc were all available in the 3.0 PHB.  Reach Spell is the only thing I mentioned not in that book.</blockquote>

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