Firing into Melee

[Atreides]

Is there a penalty for firing into Melee?

I was not able to find one, and the lack of said penalty seems odd.

 

[Kordeth]

There is not. Moreover, your own allies do not provide your target with cover (although the target's allies do). This frees ranged combat characters from essentially being required to take Point Blank Shot and Precise Shot as their first two feats in order to be useful in battle.

 

[Gloombunny]

It's a principle of good game design that if almost every player chooses a certain option, something should be changed. In 3.5, almost every PC who made a lot of ranged attacks took Precise Shot. They could've changed it by severely nerfing whatever ability in 4e improves one's ability to shoot into melee, but instead they decided to just give Precise Shot to everyone for free, which is in my opinion a much better choice.

 

[Dannyalcatraz]

OTOH, instead of giving EVERYONE the "shiny thing," they could have simply consolodated the 2 feats like they did Ambidex and TWF.

Which, IMHO, would have been much better, since it makes you expend a resource to be better at something than most other persons- reflecting time devoted to martial training with a ranged weapon.

 

[Gloombunny]

OTOH, instead of giving EVERYONE the "shiny thing," they could have simply consolodated the 2 feats like they did Ambidex and TWF.

Which, IMHO, would have been much better, since it makes you expend a resource to be better at something than most other persons- reflecting time devoted to martial training with a ranged weapon.

So... everyone who uses ranged attacks would have to take this one feat. That's better than everyone who uses ranged attacks having to take two feats, but it's still bad.

 

[Dannyalcatraz]

That's better than everyone who uses ranged attacks having to take two feats, but it's still bad.

Not as bad as everyone in the universe being equally good- good enough to not be penalized at all- at doing something that is actually quite difficult.

Yeah...

 

[Dalzig]

They're not equally good. The Ranger and Warlock receive Prime Shot which makes them better when they don't have to worry about teammates being in the way.

So while not having a penalty, they are penalized for shooting into melee. They just don't receive the bonus, which is a reverse-penalty.

 

[Dannyalcatraz]

First:

Prime Shot
If none of your allies are nearer to your target than you are, you receive a +1 Bonus to ranged attack rolls against the target.

To be "in melee," 2 opposing forces must be engaged in hand-to-hand combat with each other.

So Prime Shot is a bonus to firing at a foe who isn't closer to your alles than you are- fine for an alpha strike or attacking foes who insist on standing off- but which means it actually isn't a bonus for firing into melee like the 3.X feats.

Again, everyone is equally good at firing into melee...something very different than 3.X's PBS and PS feats.

Second: to get this bonus, you MUST start off as either a Ranger or Warlock- the so-called multiclassing feats don't get you access to that power. In 3.X, ANY PC could take Point Blank Shot and Precise Shot.

 

[small pumpkin man]

First:

To be "in melee," 2 opposing forces must be engaged in hand-to-hand combat with each other.

So Prime Shot is a bonus to firing at a foe who isn't closer to your alles than you are- fine for an alpha strike or attacking foes who insist on standing off- but which means it actually isn't a bonus for firing into melee like the 3.X feats.

Of course not, they do the complete opposite, they make the ranged classes better at shooting monsters who aren't near your allies.

Again, everyone is equally good at firing into melee...something very different than 3.X's PBS and PS feats.

Second: to get this bonus, you MUST start off as either a Ranger or Warlock- the so-called multiclassing feats don't get you access to that power. In 3.X, ANY PC could take Point Blank Shot and Precise Shot.

Exactly, what it does is instead of providing a penalty to shooting into melee, it provides the classes which have powerful ranged abilities bonuses for not shooting into melee, meaning even though there are no obvious penalties for doing so, it actually happens a lot less than 3.x (well, not counting Wizards). Awesome, huh?

 

[Dannyalcatraz]

Awesome, huh?

Not so much. Not to me.

Anyone can seem to be awesome when there's no risk of harming your allies, but it's truly awesome when you can pump your foes full of hurt at range even though they're engaging your allies. Or using someone as a human shield. Etc.