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Community
General Tabletop Discussion
D&D Older Editions
Fixing the newly broken rogue class (thanks to Andy and 3.5)
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<blockquote data-quote="totoro" data-source="post: 1023997" data-attributes="member: 11939"><p>I've heard others say that a rogue with multiple attacks is great because he gets all those sneak attacks. Unless I'm mistaken, however, a rogue with multiple attacks gets to apply his sneak attack damage once per round no matter how many attacks he makes. Otherwise I would tend to agree that sneak attack is very powerful. </p><p></p><p>As it stands, a fighter with a greatsword (at 1st level) typically does better damage than a sneak attacking rogue no matter how many weapons the rogue has. A rogue that is not sneak attacking is pathetic in comparison (as he should be since a fighter is built specifically for, well, fighting). The rogue was able to shine in other areas to make up for this. Now he doesn't shine quite as brightly.</p><p></p><p>Compare with a 1st level ranger, for example. The ranger gets +2 hp, +1 BAB, +2 Fort, track, wild empathy, favored enemy. The rogue gets trap finding, sneak attack 1d6, and 8 skill points. Trap Finding is practically worthless at this level because if the trap is DC 21, then, statistically, you are better off letting the Barbarian trigger it because he has twice as many hit points. (14 INT, disable device 4 ranks gives +6 modifier, so the DC 21 trap goes off 50% and you succeed 25%). Any DM worth his salt will have discussed the favored enemy with the ranger so that he can meet some of them early in his career. If the DM tries to balance the ranger with the rogue, I suppose he could prevent the ranger from ever getting to use his ability, but that would suck. So the favored enemy, at least at 1st level is about as good as sneak attack, which is only used during the surprise round because a rogue who tumbles back to flank will get his ass handed to him. 8 skill points is nice, but is only worth about 1.5 regular feats). That's about equivalent to +2 Fort and +2 hit points (and go ahead and throw in track and wild empathy for good measure). The ranger still gets +1 BAB.</p><p></p><p>The advantages continue to accrue for the Ranger, with the Rogue never quite keeping up. In short, the Ranger is a better scout and lookout. The Rogue eventually becomes the trap disabler. Which sounds more fun to you?</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="totoro, post: 1023997, member: 11939"] I've heard others say that a rogue with multiple attacks is great because he gets all those sneak attacks. Unless I'm mistaken, however, a rogue with multiple attacks gets to apply his sneak attack damage once per round no matter how many attacks he makes. Otherwise I would tend to agree that sneak attack is very powerful. As it stands, a fighter with a greatsword (at 1st level) typically does better damage than a sneak attacking rogue no matter how many weapons the rogue has. A rogue that is not sneak attacking is pathetic in comparison (as he should be since a fighter is built specifically for, well, fighting). The rogue was able to shine in other areas to make up for this. Now he doesn't shine quite as brightly. Compare with a 1st level ranger, for example. The ranger gets +2 hp, +1 BAB, +2 Fort, track, wild empathy, favored enemy. The rogue gets trap finding, sneak attack 1d6, and 8 skill points. Trap Finding is practically worthless at this level because if the trap is DC 21, then, statistically, you are better off letting the Barbarian trigger it because he has twice as many hit points. (14 INT, disable device 4 ranks gives +6 modifier, so the DC 21 trap goes off 50% and you succeed 25%). Any DM worth his salt will have discussed the favored enemy with the ranger so that he can meet some of them early in his career. If the DM tries to balance the ranger with the rogue, I suppose he could prevent the ranger from ever getting to use his ability, but that would suck. So the favored enemy, at least at 1st level is about as good as sneak attack, which is only used during the surprise round because a rogue who tumbles back to flank will get his ass handed to him. 8 skill points is nice, but is only worth about 1.5 regular feats). That's about equivalent to +2 Fort and +2 hit points (and go ahead and throw in track and wild empathy for good measure). The ranger still gets +1 BAB. The advantages continue to accrue for the Ranger, with the Rogue never quite keeping up. In short, the Ranger is a better scout and lookout. The Rogue eventually becomes the trap disabler. Which sounds more fun to you? [/QUOTE]
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Community
General Tabletop Discussion
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Fixing the newly broken rogue class (thanks to Andy and 3.5)
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