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Community
General Tabletop Discussion
D&D Older Editions
Fixing the newly broken rogue class (thanks to Andy and 3.5)
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<blockquote data-quote="bret" data-source="post: 1024678" data-attributes="member: 713"><p>[sarcasm]</p><p>Thank you <strong>so much</strong> for the insult.</p><p>[/sarcasm]</p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>10th level rogue: +7/+2</p><p>With size: +8/+3</p><p>With Strength: +10/+5</p><p></p><p>In 3.5 Bull's Strength only lasts for a few minutes, you *might* get it in the main battle but it isn't something you should count on.</p><p></p><p>In 3.5, Haste gives you one additional attack. That makes it +10/+10/+5 unless they are hitting you with both that and the Bull's Strength for +12/+12/+7.</p><p></p><p>Weapon is only a +1, so I get a total of +13/+13/+8 at max. Where are you getting the rest of your bonus?</p><p></p><p>In any case, a halfling would have to us a d8 Bastard sword since he is size small and you need exotic weapon proficiency to use it.</p><p></p><p>Now compare that with the fighter that is most likely going to have +10/+5 (level) +2-+3 (attribute) +4 (he will get Bull's Strength before you) +2-+3 (better weapon) plus Haste (in 3.5, it will get the whole group).</p><p></p><p>The fighter has got +18/+18/+13. His second attack is about equal to your first attack. The fighter is going to hit more often and often has several tricks that can improve his damage.</p><p></p><p>I've played the rogue, for me it has been Flurry of Misses and TWF just makes it worse.</p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>Sounds like your rogue uses up a huge percentage of the spellcasting power in your group.</p><p></p><p>If you compare a spell-buffed rogue with a fighter having no spells on them, then I suppose it looks impressive.</p><p></p><p>In my experience, the rogue is often missing. Since most of my play is 3.0 and we only just got to the level where mass haste comes in, I'm not sure how much haste would affect this. I can work the numbers, but as you correctly pointed out that doesn't tell the whole story.</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="bret, post: 1024678, member: 713"] [sarcasm] Thank you [b]so much[/b] for the insult. [/sarcasm] 10th level rogue: +7/+2 With size: +8/+3 With Strength: +10/+5 In 3.5 Bull's Strength only lasts for a few minutes, you *might* get it in the main battle but it isn't something you should count on. In 3.5, Haste gives you one additional attack. That makes it +10/+10/+5 unless they are hitting you with both that and the Bull's Strength for +12/+12/+7. Weapon is only a +1, so I get a total of +13/+13/+8 at max. Where are you getting the rest of your bonus? In any case, a halfling would have to us a d8 Bastard sword since he is size small and you need exotic weapon proficiency to use it. Now compare that with the fighter that is most likely going to have +10/+5 (level) +2-+3 (attribute) +4 (he will get Bull's Strength before you) +2-+3 (better weapon) plus Haste (in 3.5, it will get the whole group). The fighter has got +18/+18/+13. His second attack is about equal to your first attack. The fighter is going to hit more often and often has several tricks that can improve his damage. I've played the rogue, for me it has been Flurry of Misses and TWF just makes it worse. Sounds like your rogue uses up a huge percentage of the spellcasting power in your group. If you compare a spell-buffed rogue with a fighter having no spells on them, then I suppose it looks impressive. In my experience, the rogue is often missing. Since most of my play is 3.0 and we only just got to the level where mass haste comes in, I'm not sure how much haste would affect this. I can work the numbers, but as you correctly pointed out that doesn't tell the whole story. [/QUOTE]
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Community
General Tabletop Discussion
D&D Older Editions
Fixing the newly broken rogue class (thanks to Andy and 3.5)
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