Forked Thread: Is ENWorld an accurate cross section of gamers?
- Thread starter El Mahdi
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TwinBahamut
First Post
There is no way that ENWorld is a representative sample, for reasons given by other posters.
If nothing else, ENWorld's somewhat older age demographic, focus on third-party support, general fondness for older editions (even if it just takes the form of nostalgia), celebration of certain playstyles (such as rat-bastard DMing), and other such quirks will push it away from being a representative sample, even if the Player/DM responses were not already so visibly imbalanced in your poll (when I responded, "mostly DM" was clearly winning).
Actually, the fact that I have seen countless people praising this forum as being better than any other D&D forum (often and loudly enough that it begins to annoy me at times) should be proof enough. ENWorld has a noticeably different population than places like the WotC boards or other boards (not familiar with too many of them), which is both the reason some people like these forums and the reason that any data taken from ENWorld simply would not be the same as the data you would get from one of those boards.
If nothing else, ENWorld's somewhat older age demographic, focus on third-party support, general fondness for older editions (even if it just takes the form of nostalgia), celebration of certain playstyles (such as rat-bastard DMing), and other such quirks will push it away from being a representative sample, even if the Player/DM responses were not already so visibly imbalanced in your poll (when I responded, "mostly DM" was clearly winning).
Actually, the fact that I have seen countless people praising this forum as being better than any other D&D forum (often and loudly enough that it begins to annoy me at times) should be proof enough. ENWorld has a noticeably different population than places like the WotC boards or other boards (not familiar with too many of them), which is both the reason some people like these forums and the reason that any data taken from ENWorld simply would not be the same as the data you would get from one of those boards.
Treebore
First Post
FYI, random sampling is not the only way to gather useful data, it is simply the easiest, cheapest, and most popular way. There are other methods, plus numerous powerful mathematical statistical formula's that can also be applied to increase accuracy.
The key is knowing what the question is, how it is asked, and how it is answered.
You only need to know "demographics" if you want to apply it to those demographics. If your only "demographic" of concern is "are they RPG gamers with an interest in D&D", then that is the only demographic you need to question.
As for the idea that polls on this site are "self selected", all people who answer polls/surveys are "self selected". Why? Because they chose to volunteer to respond. So since all polls are voluntary, they are all self selected.
So posting a "survey question" on this site is no different than sending out 7000 questionaires to known gamers (like those survey cards you have seen in various RPG books) and having 600, 800, or 2000 people CHOSE to fill them out and send them back in. That is "self selection".
Just because you didn't have a card to fill in and send back in the mail doesn't make it different than answering a poll on this board.
So even though they like to try for a "random sample" the reality is you will still only get responses from people who want to respond. Self selection.
Now the poll linked in the OP could be made even more valuable. You could ask demographic data, such as ages, income, address, but all that would do is maybe reveal something interesting about those specific demographics, but even that won't be defining because you won't be getting a high number of respondents from every demographic. You might have 400 ages 30 to 35, is that big enough to tell you anything meaningful about that demographic? Maybe, but not as reliably as it would if you had 1000 30 to 35 year olds respond.
So in this case the only important demographic of any meaning is "do you play D&D?" If you do then you can give a meaningful response to the polls question. It will apply to gamers in general, the ones who play D&D and have checked out 3rd and 4th edition.
The poll asks that only such people respond, and it is assumed, because it has to be, that respondents are answering honestly, just like in any other poll.
Take phone polling for example, How do you know the person on the other end is telling you the truth? How do you know that it isn't the persons kid? Or a childs friend who is visiting? Even if you are talking to the head of house hold like you want, how do you know they are telling you the truth about their age? Income? Employment status? You don't. You have to assume honesty.
So as much as people want to think otherwise, polls on ENWorld can be valid and highly accurate.
The key is knowing what the question is, how it is asked, and how it is answered.
You only need to know "demographics" if you want to apply it to those demographics. If your only "demographic" of concern is "are they RPG gamers with an interest in D&D", then that is the only demographic you need to question.
As for the idea that polls on this site are "self selected", all people who answer polls/surveys are "self selected". Why? Because they chose to volunteer to respond. So since all polls are voluntary, they are all self selected.
So posting a "survey question" on this site is no different than sending out 7000 questionaires to known gamers (like those survey cards you have seen in various RPG books) and having 600, 800, or 2000 people CHOSE to fill them out and send them back in. That is "self selection".
Just because you didn't have a card to fill in and send back in the mail doesn't make it different than answering a poll on this board.
So even though they like to try for a "random sample" the reality is you will still only get responses from people who want to respond. Self selection.
Now the poll linked in the OP could be made even more valuable. You could ask demographic data, such as ages, income, address, but all that would do is maybe reveal something interesting about those specific demographics, but even that won't be defining because you won't be getting a high number of respondents from every demographic. You might have 400 ages 30 to 35, is that big enough to tell you anything meaningful about that demographic? Maybe, but not as reliably as it would if you had 1000 30 to 35 year olds respond.
So in this case the only important demographic of any meaning is "do you play D&D?" If you do then you can give a meaningful response to the polls question. It will apply to gamers in general, the ones who play D&D and have checked out 3rd and 4th edition.
The poll asks that only such people respond, and it is assumed, because it has to be, that respondents are answering honestly, just like in any other poll.
Take phone polling for example, How do you know the person on the other end is telling you the truth? How do you know that it isn't the persons kid? Or a childs friend who is visiting? Even if you are talking to the head of house hold like you want, how do you know they are telling you the truth about their age? Income? Employment status? You don't. You have to assume honesty.
So as much as people want to think otherwise, polls on ENWorld can be valid and highly accurate.
Edena_of_Neith
First Post
This poll seems to indicate that ENWorld is more a DM's Forum, as it were.
Darkwolf71
First Post
Not precisely true, which is part of the point.
Clearly, the folks here are "RPG gamers with an interest in D&D". However, if we are in some way unlike other RPG gamers with an interest in D&D, the results you get asking questions here will not simply generalize to all RPG gamers with an interest in D&D.
Half true. Yes, choosing to answer the questions is a form of self selection. However, that is not the only form of selection going on. Basically, the EN World population is doubly selected on such a poll - once for being the type of person who answers polls, and once for being the type of person who comes and reads EN World enough to see the poll.
That's two filters that might introduce bias in the results, rather than just one.
Older, and more GMs. We're an important demographic because we have lots of money that we can and often do spend on RPGs. So the average D&D player may be a 15 year old high school student, but they ain't got the spending power of the average ENW-er. 
Although GW's teen-oriented approach to Warhammer Battle seems to work for them ok.
Although GW's teen-oriented approach to Warhammer Battle seems to work for them ok.
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