Forked Thread: Official Ruling on Stinking Cloud? (What about Wall of Fire?)

[Caliber]

Forked from: Official Ruling on Stinking Cloud?

You're probably right about the forcing movement not triggering the damage, though I can't find any rule about that specifically. But if you look at page 285, Forced movement 1) does not trigger opportunity attacks, 2) is not hindered or affected by difficult terrain, and 3) does not count as a move against the target's speed... from these three I think it's pretty sfae to conclude that forced movement is NOT meant to trigger stuff like Stinking Cloud's damage, or any zone-entering harmful effects in general.

For a Stinking Cloud, this ruling kinda makes sense, sure, but what about a Wall of Fire? If a Wizard wanted to set up a wall of fire moving away from him, then whack a baddie with a massive slide and ping-pong him back and forth through the wall, is that legit? Do you give the baddie a saving throw to fall prone? What think you guys?

 

[Tony Vargas]

If you're moving someone into a square that causes damage, yes, the save should aply.

I find the whole idea of weaving someone into and out of such terrain in a single involuntary move silly, but whatever. If you don't find it silly, at least grant the save /every time/, until the target is prone (that ends the involuntary movement).

The weaving back and forth thing makes more sense if the power explicitly causes damage for entering any single square of the effect, rather than just entering the effect as a whole. If you can walk around inside the thing and take damage only once, being flicked in and out of it shouldn't be any worse.

 

[Runestar]

It would work with powers such as thunderwave (assuming your wisdom is high enough). Even when the foe is being pushed in a zig-zag manner, he is still moving further away from you, and thunderwave does not state that he must move in a straight line. So in this manner, you can push him in and out of a wall of fire multiple times, and he should take damage for each time he moves through it.

 

[Harr]

What about if the wizard casts the wall of fire (or stinking cloud, or any zone-damage) on top of an enemy then? He technically 'entered' the zone: he wasn't inside a wall of fire, then he was inside. Does the enemy take damage from the entering part of the wall of fire?

If you're moving someone into a square that causes damage, yes, the save should apply.

And what if you're moving a square that causes damage onto someone, do they take damage? Some zones let you move them around.

 

[Caliban]

For those you who care about Customer Service responses, this is what I got the last time this question came up:

Subject
Do damaging spell effects count as "Hindering Terrain"
Discussion Thread Response (Support Agent)09/19/2008 09:51 AM
Hello Caliban,

Damaging spell effects do not count as hindering terrain, and so monsters do not get a saving throw to avoid forced movement into them. It makes no difference if it's a cloud of daggers or a wall of fire.


Let me know if you have any more questions. Have fun with 4th edition!


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Customer (Caliban)09/18/2008 09:30 PM
Page 44 of the DMG states that targets get a save to avoid being forced into Hindering Terrain (which is on page 61). Do spell effects such as Cloud of Daggers or the various Wall spells count as Hindering Terrain? Does a target get a save to avoid being pushed, pulled, or slid into a damaging spell effect? What about one that blocks line of sight, such as Wall of Fire?

Thank you.

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Page Number: Page 44 and 61
Book Name: Dungeon Master's Guide (4e)