Forked Thread: ... with an interesting note about 4th edition

[Imaro]

Yes, that seems most likely. So why would you think they would do a second print run just because they're out of gift sets?

Why would they do this if they had unsold PHB, DMG and MM? Repackaging existing product would be much more cost-efficient that printing a whole bunch of new books just for the gift sets. Print runs achieve their cost efficiency due to high volumes.

Uhm, because the single books have already been sent out to distributors???

EDIT: Or there may not be enough in equal quantities to make the gift sets.

Yeah, but if you aren’t selling single MM and DMG but are selling boatloads of the gift sets…doesn’t it make sense to reprint enough to do another run or two of just gift sets? And you can still claim, with complete technical honesty, that you went to a second and third print run, even if those print runs were only gift sets. I say “technical honesty” because in this scenario you’re actually manipulating the products (which should be separate as in gift sets vs. core books) and “technically”allowing one product to represent both.

Sure, it's possible. Perhaps you can provide some evidence which might lead us to think it's true, though? 'Possible' and 'relevant' are very different things.

Yeah, well show me some evidence it didn’t happen… I mean really we both know neither I nor you are employees of WotC and thus have nothing but anecdotal evidence. So I guess this is your way of trying to shut down the idea that it is possible. How about this…

Let a rep from WotC come here and post “Imaro, you are wrong, we sold out of the entire print runs of corebooks and single books twice, and are currently on our third print run of both” …and I’d have no recourse but to accept it. Until then…

 

[Imaro]

If by 'gift sets' you mean 'gift set boxes', the things in which you put the three books to make it a gift set, obviously yes you'd have to have a new run for those. But the books for the gift sets would not be printed separately than those not intended for the gift sets. There would be no 'gift set run' of the books themselves.

Why wouldn't there be? since a gift set has to have all three books printed in the same quantitiy (20 PHB, 20 MM, 20 DMG), or else it's not a gift set... while single books don't (you can have 50 PHB, 10 DMG and 10 MM). There has to be a certain number designated for gift sets ( a seperate print run for the gift sets) and a certain number designated to be sold singly, and these can vary wildly.

 

[xechnao]

Why wouldn't there be? since a gift set has to have all three books printed in the same quantitiy (20 PHB, 20 MM, 20 DMG), or else it's not a gift set... while single books don't (you can have 50 PHB, 10 DMG and 10 MM). There has to be a certain number designated for gift sets ( a seperate print run for the gift sets) and a certain number designated to be sold singly, and these can vary wildly.

Indeed. I was under the impression that the gift sets should have been set as different print runs. I was also in doubt about that the books of the gift set being identical to those sold apart because of something I had read somewhere on the forums.

 

[Wootz]

I think price has something to do with it. Maybe.

 

[The Little Raven]

Sadly, people are sheep. If something is selling well, many of them will want to jump on the bandwagon - lest they get left behind...

It's the rift in the D&D player base that's the real problem...

You do realize that it's statements like the first that cause the second, right? Or did it not occur to you that insulting people's intelligence and resolve simply because they have a different opinion than you might make them dislike you?

 

[The Little Raven]

Yeah, well show me some evidence it didn’t happen.

That's not how that works.

Burden of proof - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

 

[Fifth Element]

Uhm, because the single books have already been sent out to distributors???

EDIT: Or there may not be enough in equal quantities to make the gift sets.

Okay, maybe I misunderstood what you were trying to say. Are you saying that all the books they printed are already in the distribution system, so they would then print more? That sounds fairly standard. And also not deceptive.

Yeah, well show me some evidence it didn’t happen… I mean really we both know neither I nor you are employees of WotC and thus have nothing but anecdotal evidence. So I guess this is your way of trying to shut down the idea that it is possible. How about this…

I already said it's possible. But I submit that since you are the one suggesting that WotC might be deliberately misleading in this way, you are the one who needs to provide some evidence.

Let a rep from WotC come here and post “Imaro, you are wrong, we sold out of the entire print runs of corebooks and single books twice, and are currently on our third print run of both” …and I’d have no recourse but to accept it. Until then…

...you can just make up whatever you want? 'Hey, wouldn't WotC be evil if they did this?'

 

[Jack99]

Yes, but implying that people who buy 4E are "sheep" will help heal that rift in no time!

Mææææhhhh

 

[Imaro]

That's not how that works.

Burden of proof - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Okay Mourn, since we're suddenly playing this game... where is the proof that 4e has sold better than 1e, 2e, 3e or 3.5? Do we have any information on the actual sales of 4e? Or just on print runs. Because numerous people (including you I believe) have used anecdotal evidence to make proclamations about 4e's sales, when in fact there is no real proof.

 

[I'm A Banana]

Hey!

You! Yes you! The poster who is thinking that Dragon Snack is calling all 4e fans sheep!

Calm down!

In my reading, Dragon Snack wasn't calling all people who like 4e sheep.

He was calling people who buy 4e just because it has big sales numbers sheep.

Sheep in the sense of "follow the herd."

So if you bought 4e because everyone else was buying 4e (because those sales must mean it's popular!), you followed the herd.

If you bought 4e because you thought it was a great game and wanted to play it, you're not a sheep, because you didn't do it to follow the herd.

Thor's balls, people are quick to take offense!

("You" left deliberately ambiguous, because You Know Who You Are. )

I mean, maybe I'm being overly charitable, but the post mostly talks about how people who only follow what's hot this week are kind of annoying, goes on to say we ALL have games on our shelves we're not playing, supplements we're not using (because we probably do, unless we're some sort of hyper-focused genius), and that the real problem is this back-biting.

"People are sheep" is a general phrase bemoaning the basic state of humanity.

He didn't say "People who like 4e are sheep just going for the next hot thing," which would be pretty maddening.

"People." Not "4e fans."

There is a difference.