Found the fun in gaming again

[Elf Witch]

Tonight I rediscovered something that has been missing for awhile in my gaming. Fun. Lately I have been bored and burnt out and ready to throw the towel in. But tonight that changed. Because I realized what had been killing all the joy for me.

When I first started gaming I did not know all the rules or the monsters or even how much damage each weapon did. I made all my decsions based on what I thought the character would do in a given situation. And I just loved gaming.

Slowly over time playing that way has been beat out of me. The game became all about tactics and learning the unwritten rules like never split the party and such. Everything became planning and having optimal choices and never doing anything that might piss off the powerful people or god forbid get the characters in hot water.

Sure we had a better chance of living but the game became stagnant for me. It took hours to decide the most optimal plan. Everybody would jump on any player who tried to do something new.

Tonight I did something I had not in a long time I threw caution to the wind and just did what my character would do without worrying about all the possible horrible consquences. And everybody had a great time and we had a lot of laughs.

We had gone into a bar to get infomation from these bad guys the plan was to try and evesdrop on them or if worse came to worse follow one of them drunk home and have the mage cast charm. We were not all at full hitpoints and they were. We are a party made up of second and third level PCS and they had a mage and a barbarian with an axe. By all logic we should have not done anything to get into it with them. That axe alone had the power to instanly kill any one of us.

As we were trying to evesdrop my character tried some strong wine that made her throw up. The bad guys started laughing at her. Without thinking I threw down a gold piece and bet one of them could not keep it down either. The leader with the axe the town's bully came up and just tried to take my gold. Again I reacted in character and plunged my dagger in his hand. A huge fight broke out. We almost died one of us went to -6 I got hit once with the axe and went to 0. But we won in the end with our mage beating the barbarian to death with his quaterstaff. It was great. We ended up getting the info we needed some cool items and the bars respect.

But the best thing was the laughter at the table the high fiving when the mage took out the barbarian.

I am not going to say that trying to plan is bad but I think you can go to far and if you are not careful it can suck all the fun out of the game.

 

[SweeneyTodd]

I've been there. I know exactly what you mean.

 

[Teflon Billy]

Yep, this sounds familair as all hell

Glad you worked it out. That endless "Plan, Plan, Plan...eliminate risk" mindset that (I think) Everquest players bring to the table aggravated me for months.

 

[applenerd]

My last campaign sort of fizzled for the reasons you stated. Everyone just stopped having fun. I had to start playing with another group where I play everything from dnd to lexicon to octaNe to paranoia to the new warhammer fantasy rpg to find the fun again. And it's been a blast! It sounds like I've had a very similar experience to yours.

I've found that it makes a big difference who you game with. If you play with good gamers it can make a world of difference.

Also in my opinion, one shots can be a great cure to a stale campaign because the lack of long term consequences frees people to be more creative. And that leads to fun and hopefully more creativeness in a campaign.

 

[shilsen]

I am not going to say that trying to plan is bad but I think you can go to far and if you are not careful it can suck all the fun out of the game.

True. I just wonder what your (and your group's) opinion about your action would have been if it had ended in a TPK, and esp. a boring one.

 

[Elf Witch]

True. I just wonder what your (and your group's) opinion about your action would have been if it had ended in a TPK, and esp. a boring one.

Yes a TPK would have sucked but they suck no matter when they happen. And IMO a DM has the power over TPKs he can choose to fudge rolls or pull a rabbit out of his hat. In this case he could have easily stopeed a TPK by having the city guard come in and arrest everyone or since the bar had other customers all who hated the bully maybe they would have been inspired to jump in.

The player who went to -6 is my roommate and we discussed it on the way home. As she pointed out the session before she went to -8. We were exploring an old tomb and triggered a security device. As she said dead is dead and it makes no difference if you die looting a tomb or in a barfight. Neither are very heroic noble deaths.

It is not just the overplanning that has ruined the game for me. DnD had become more of what you cannot do rather than what you can do. For example in our Kalamar game we came across an evil temple doing evil things. We were sixth level at the time. My character carried a special sword. It was sentient and had been a paladin before being turned into a sword. The sword kept encourging me to do something to stop this temple. But the party refused to even try. Why? One of those unwritten rules of you can't take on an evil temple until epic or near epic levels. They would not even really investigate because of the possibilty that there might be a cleric who would cast a speak with god or some other divination that might identify us. I was so frustrated with them that my character just went behind the party's back and did things. Which was a mistake on my part because it caused all kinds of chaos in the group itself.

After that I just stopped doing anything without party approval. My roommate felt the same frustrations of what she termed the new politically correct way of playing that had infected the party. I think it happened because we had a new DM and a new player and our old DM was now playing and that mix just brought out the strategy wargamer mindset. That coupled with all that prior gaming experience of what are the most optimal ways of doing things. It sucked all the creativity and spontaneity right out of the game.

Gaming is supposed to be fun and I think it is supposed to be about heroes who take chances. With my party's mindset Frodo and Sam would never have gone to MT Doom because it would not make sense for low level character who are not even a full party with very few magical devices to try and take on Saron. Nope better wait until epic levels for that. :\

 

[VirgilCaine]

It is not just the overplanning that has ruined the game for me. DnD had become more of what you cannot do rather than what you can do. For example in our Kalamar game we came across an evil temple doing evil things. We were sixth level at the time. My character carried a special sword. It was sentient and had been a paladin before being turned into a sword. The sword kept encourging me to do something to stop this temple. But the party refused to even try. Why? One of those unwritten rules of you can't take on an evil temple until epic or near epic levels. They would not even really investigate because of the possibilty that there might be a cleric who would cast a speak with god or some other divination that might identify us.

Those are some weird players. Sounds like they got burned by a bad DM.
I could see not doing anything without backup or being careful, but worrying about a cleric casting Contact Other Plane and finding out who you are--that's ridiculous! How does a power know who the PCs are anyway?

 

[SpiralBound]

Just what are these unwritten rules? I've never heard of them... Don't attack an evil temple until epic level? Man, just try and STOP my players!! lol! "don't split the party"? Sometimes that's the BEST way to solve a given situation!

I am curious to know what other unwritten rules your group plays by. I think that they may make for good reading on things to watch out for to prevent ruining gameplay! BTW, I mean no offence, I'm serious. I'd be quite interested to know of another groups assumptions on the "proper" way to play D&D. Ithink that it would be very illuminating and genuinely useful. Especially since as you stated, this is a group that was leaching out all the fun from the game until you threw out these unwritten rules. So, write 'em down! drag these dastardly game-killing unwritten rules out into the light of the written word so that we may properly deal with them!

 

[Elf Witch]

Those are some weird players. Sounds like they got burned by a bad DM.
I could see not doing anything without backup or being careful, but worrying about a cleric casting Contact Other Plane and finding out who you are--that's ridiculous! How does a power know who the PCs are anyway?

It is mainly one player who is very vocal and very strong willed. It is his playing style. He is a power gamer and what he enjoys most about the game is amassing power. For example if he plays a rogue he wants to build or take over a powerful thieves guild. As he mage he is the most powerful mage on the planet things like that.

When he builds his character he knows every feat and skill he will have all the way up to 20th level. He makes long range plans for all his characters.

This leads to a desire not to die or have anything derail his plans so he is super cautious about all encounters. Tries to micromanage all the game details and this leads to him trying to control the other player's character as well.

With the right DM he can be controlled but our current DM feels that he can't control him that easily part of this is that the DM was new to DMing and the player already had the bit between his teeth and had run out of control in the game. And the DM is one of these people who does not want any stress in the game so he just tries to smooth the water.

 

[Elf Witch]

Just what are these unwritten rules? I've never heard of them... Don't attack an evil temple until epic level? Man, just try and STOP my players!! lol! "don't split the party"? Sometimes that's the BEST way to solve a given situation!

I am curious to know what other unwritten rules your group plays by. I think that they may make for good reading on things to watch out for to prevent ruining gameplay! BTW, I mean no offence, I'm serious. I'd be quite interested to know of another groups assumptions on the "proper" way to play D&D. Ithink that it would be very illuminating and genuinely useful. Especially since as you stated, this is a group that was leaching out all the fun from the game until you threw out these unwritten rules. So, write 'em down! drag these dastardly game-killing unwritten rules out into the light of the written word so that we may properly deal with them!

Well here goes. You never say anything that is not flattery to anyone in power. Which means you never disagree with them or god forbid come out and and tell them they are wrong.

You never show mercy to an enemy. Even if said enemy is not evil and is nothing more than a hired merc doing his job. Oh no you kill him and take his stuff.

When playing in Kalamar you don't help any of the secret groups like say the Broken Chain free slaves because even though you all think slavery is evil and wrong you don't want to take a chance of the powerful merchants guild the Golden Alliance coming after you.

You always keep all your loot even if it belongs to an ally who you know has a family. You don't even go to them because they might ask for it back.

Don't make any role playing choices if they might be sub optimal or even worse might have a negative impact on the party's power or might come back to haunt you later.

It is perfectly acceptable and not bad manners to try and drag the DM into helping stop a role play choice by saying "would his character do that"

Sorcerers must only take powerful spells and be all about blasting everything or they have no place in the game.

Clerics can never refuse to heal a party member even if that party member has totaaly offended the cleric and his god.

It is bad to ever take the side of an NPC over a PC no matter the circumstances.

These play out in almost every game we play in sometimes with the right DM a lot of it gets thrown by the wayside but it is what has lately been just killing the game for me.