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Gamer Stats From White Dwarf in the 80s
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<blockquote data-quote="JonnyP71" data-source="post: 7783922" data-attributes="member: 6788862"><p>Thinking about the 'getting defensive' comments... I guess it's time to address that, and the statements to that effect.</p><p></p><p>Many people making such comments in this thread are not from the UK, and are likely not of the same age. The original post was referring to a specific poll in an edition of White Dwarf, referring to the UK gaming community. As I was 15-16, am a white male, and mainly played AD&D, I am firmly in the largest group in that poll, the most common type of gamer surveyed - by a mile. Thus, when criticising the poll results, claiming it was because the community was 'toxic' and 'non-inclusive', you are directly insulting me.</p><p></p><p>I have no control over my race, my gender, my upbringing, my school - and had very very limited influence over my social circle.</p><p></p><p>As a geeky little kid with ADHD, in an academically elite school, I was marginalised. My love of gaming only made this worse. All I ever strove for was to be accepted, and it was among fellow gaming geeks that I found that acceptance, a little clique of other lads, who for one reason or another were also on the fringes to some degree.... race and sexuality did not come into it, we didn't care, we just wanted to play games and not be bothered by other people.</p><p></p><p>To be told we should have created a safe space for possible female gamers is quite frankly ridiculous, we were boys in our mid teens who never spoke to females, it was an all-male private school.... Girls were scary, vicious creatures who pointed at us geeks, mocked us - at least that's what was firmly in our heads, due to common shared experiences. If there were exceptions, we didn't notice them as the vocal majority drowned them out.</p><p></p><p>And even if change would have been possible, we weren't aware there was even a problem with a lack of females in the hobby, because due to that vocal group who were doing the mocking, in our insecure, shy, nervous teenage minds, girls were not interested in us, or our games. So why would we even realise it was a 'problem' if there weren't any female gamers? It was just 'normal'. Saying we should have acted to rectify a problem we didn't know existed is akin to a person I don't know in the next street blaming me for his car getting a puncture because I didn't warn him a specific road had a problem with potholes!!!!</p><p></p><p>Our situation (geeks at an all male school) would have been mirrored all over the country in the early-mid 1980s. There were a few little clusters of gamers at my school in a couple of year groups. My brother and sister went to a much bigger mixed (state) school and saw no D&D played there. I had some local friends who also attended mixed (state) schools, they generally had no interest in RPGs, or had not even heard of them. There were some who I didn't dare mention gaming in front of for fear of being ostracised, the ultimate punishment for a teenage boy. </p><p></p><p>The hobby was much more niche here than in the USA, and I guess from my experience above, it was MUCH more common in the more academically orientated private school system. These are mostly single sex schools - which further widens any initial divide - more intellectually motivated, geeky kids, who tend to struggle with social skills, as that is (sadly) our way, and therefore even less interaction between the sexes.</p><p></p><p>So by railing against 'people getting defensive', by blaming the main UK gaming demographic at the time for the imbalance (toxic, unwelcoming, etc), you are basically insulting us over something we had NO control over. Is it any different to racist, sexist or homophobic insults in that sense? </p><p></p><p>Yes, among slightly older (19+), college based gaming groups, we would have had antagonistic, chauvinistic neckbeards doing as antagonistic, chauvinistic neckbeards do..... But the main demographic in that poll had NOTHING to do with those idiots. We were kids, just trying to find our way in a big, scary, unwelcoming world, and discovering solace in gaming.</p><p></p><p>So maybe try to *think* before you know it all. Ask questions. And don't jump to conclusions. And don't be surprised if people get defensive if you start making sweeping, ill-informed statements.</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="JonnyP71, post: 7783922, member: 6788862"] Thinking about the 'getting defensive' comments... I guess it's time to address that, and the statements to that effect. Many people making such comments in this thread are not from the UK, and are likely not of the same age. The original post was referring to a specific poll in an edition of White Dwarf, referring to the UK gaming community. As I was 15-16, am a white male, and mainly played AD&D, I am firmly in the largest group in that poll, the most common type of gamer surveyed - by a mile. Thus, when criticising the poll results, claiming it was because the community was 'toxic' and 'non-inclusive', you are directly insulting me. I have no control over my race, my gender, my upbringing, my school - and had very very limited influence over my social circle. As a geeky little kid with ADHD, in an academically elite school, I was marginalised. My love of gaming only made this worse. All I ever strove for was to be accepted, and it was among fellow gaming geeks that I found that acceptance, a little clique of other lads, who for one reason or another were also on the fringes to some degree.... race and sexuality did not come into it, we didn't care, we just wanted to play games and not be bothered by other people. To be told we should have created a safe space for possible female gamers is quite frankly ridiculous, we were boys in our mid teens who never spoke to females, it was an all-male private school.... Girls were scary, vicious creatures who pointed at us geeks, mocked us - at least that's what was firmly in our heads, due to common shared experiences. If there were exceptions, we didn't notice them as the vocal majority drowned them out. And even if change would have been possible, we weren't aware there was even a problem with a lack of females in the hobby, because due to that vocal group who were doing the mocking, in our insecure, shy, nervous teenage minds, girls were not interested in us, or our games. So why would we even realise it was a 'problem' if there weren't any female gamers? It was just 'normal'. Saying we should have acted to rectify a problem we didn't know existed is akin to a person I don't know in the next street blaming me for his car getting a puncture because I didn't warn him a specific road had a problem with potholes!!!! Our situation (geeks at an all male school) would have been mirrored all over the country in the early-mid 1980s. There were a few little clusters of gamers at my school in a couple of year groups. My brother and sister went to a much bigger mixed (state) school and saw no D&D played there. I had some local friends who also attended mixed (state) schools, they generally had no interest in RPGs, or had not even heard of them. There were some who I didn't dare mention gaming in front of for fear of being ostracised, the ultimate punishment for a teenage boy. The hobby was much more niche here than in the USA, and I guess from my experience above, it was MUCH more common in the more academically orientated private school system. These are mostly single sex schools - which further widens any initial divide - more intellectually motivated, geeky kids, who tend to struggle with social skills, as that is (sadly) our way, and therefore even less interaction between the sexes. So by railing against 'people getting defensive', by blaming the main UK gaming demographic at the time for the imbalance (toxic, unwelcoming, etc), you are basically insulting us over something we had NO control over. Is it any different to racist, sexist or homophobic insults in that sense? Yes, among slightly older (19+), college based gaming groups, we would have had antagonistic, chauvinistic neckbeards doing as antagonistic, chauvinistic neckbeards do..... But the main demographic in that poll had NOTHING to do with those idiots. We were kids, just trying to find our way in a big, scary, unwelcoming world, and discovering solace in gaming. So maybe try to *think* before you know it all. Ask questions. And don't jump to conclusions. And don't be surprised if people get defensive if you start making sweeping, ill-informed statements. [/QUOTE]
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