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Games with "terrible" follow-up editions
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<blockquote data-quote="Ruin Explorer" data-source="post: 8633115" data-attributes="member: 18"><p>I should have listed <strong>Champions: New Millennium</strong>, but it's a weird one for our group, because we didn't like the previous editions either.</p><p></p><p>We didn't like Champions/Hero, like, ever. We tried very hard to like it as everyone told us it was the best supers game, but I dunno who it was in the group who described it as something like "Tedious WW2 squad combat skirmish wargame meets overcomplicated and poorly-balanced power design rules", probably my brother, but it stuck. Apart from GURPS Supers (which might as well have been called "GURPS: This is why you don't give people 400 points and access to all the books"), I've never played a superhero RPG that felt <em>less</em> about superheroes/superheroics.</p><p></p><p>We thought, fools that we were, that Fuzion might fix the issues Champions had by using a more streamlined system. Oh boy.</p><p></p><p>So we bought C:NM. Everyone made PCs, and there were some great ideas even if it was a bit "Image era" (esp. given one of the PCs had a backstory that involved that he was "never going back to jail"), and I set up a first adventure, which admittedly, did feature a good number of super-villains to fight at once. I was familiar with Fuzion's rules and very familiar with Interlock, as were we all.</p><p></p><p>The adventure started okay, but when we got to the "big fight", which might have taken, say, 40 minutes or so to resolve in Marvel FASERIP, say, things really bogged down. Turns out C:NM was neither fish nor fowl and had brought in tons of clunk from Champions, and lots of needless analysis-paralysis-encouraging choices from Fuzion.</p><p></p><p>The big fight took 5 hours to resolve. For what in game took, IIRC, 3 minutes.</p><p></p><p>Now I'm sure us being new to this specific version of Fuzion was part of it, but 5 hours?! For like, 4 superheroes vs 5 villains (two of the latter kind of weedy). Good god. It may be the only RPG that my group played and then said "Okay, we're not playing this ever again" after a single session of. It wasn't even a fun 5 hours, particularly not as the segment-based system meant some players got way more "goes" than others (of course the analysis paralysis made this even worse, esp. as the player with the most "goes" had unwittingly designed his PC to give himself particularly acute analysis paralysis).</p><p></p><p>EDIT - Man I really want to complain GURPS Supers more one day, good god that was a bad idea. C:NM was tedious but GURPS Supers was just basically a bad idea from the ground up.</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="Ruin Explorer, post: 8633115, member: 18"] I should have listed [B]Champions: New Millennium[/B], but it's a weird one for our group, because we didn't like the previous editions either. We didn't like Champions/Hero, like, ever. We tried very hard to like it as everyone told us it was the best supers game, but I dunno who it was in the group who described it as something like "Tedious WW2 squad combat skirmish wargame meets overcomplicated and poorly-balanced power design rules", probably my brother, but it stuck. Apart from GURPS Supers (which might as well have been called "GURPS: This is why you don't give people 400 points and access to all the books"), I've never played a superhero RPG that felt [I]less[/I] about superheroes/superheroics. We thought, fools that we were, that Fuzion might fix the issues Champions had by using a more streamlined system. Oh boy. So we bought C:NM. Everyone made PCs, and there were some great ideas even if it was a bit "Image era" (esp. given one of the PCs had a backstory that involved that he was "never going back to jail"), and I set up a first adventure, which admittedly, did feature a good number of super-villains to fight at once. I was familiar with Fuzion's rules and very familiar with Interlock, as were we all. The adventure started okay, but when we got to the "big fight", which might have taken, say, 40 minutes or so to resolve in Marvel FASERIP, say, things really bogged down. Turns out C:NM was neither fish nor fowl and had brought in tons of clunk from Champions, and lots of needless analysis-paralysis-encouraging choices from Fuzion. The big fight took 5 hours to resolve. For what in game took, IIRC, 3 minutes. Now I'm sure us being new to this specific version of Fuzion was part of it, but 5 hours?! For like, 4 superheroes vs 5 villains (two of the latter kind of weedy). Good god. It may be the only RPG that my group played and then said "Okay, we're not playing this ever again" after a single session of. It wasn't even a fun 5 hours, particularly not as the segment-based system meant some players got way more "goes" than others (of course the analysis paralysis made this even worse, esp. as the player with the most "goes" had unwittingly designed his PC to give himself particularly acute analysis paralysis). EDIT - Man I really want to complain GURPS Supers more one day, good god that was a bad idea. C:NM was tedious but GURPS Supers was just basically a bad idea from the ground up. [/QUOTE]
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