Ghaele and other monsters that cast spells as clerics

[hammymchamham]

Can they spontaneously cast cure spells as well?

 

[Merlion]

I dont think so but then again the MM doesnt even seem to be able to decide if they get bonus spell slots from Domains and high Wisdom or not. Although since it says "casts spells as a cleric of blah blah" with no qualifcations and thats part of clerical spellcasting I dont see why they couldnt.

 

[Trine]

I'm not sure, exactly. I thought no, at first, because the spontaneous casting is listed separately from the spells. But so are all of things about domains, and as far as I know Ghaeles and others get domains too, albeit in a different way from clerics. Blech.

So, I'm inclined to say yes but I don't think the rules are terribly clear either way.

 

[hammymchamham]

you guys have the same thinking as me, but I keep bouncing back and forth between Yes and No. So more thoughts would be apreciated

aka Bump!

 

[Skade]

I should say no. The reason for this is that they have not taken the class, and are in effect simply channeling divine magic as one would. They do not gain the proficiencies, nor skills of a cleric, and also should not get domains and spntaneous casting, nor turning undead.

On the other hand, give them all of the above abilities and raise the CR to reflect those new toys.

 

[Pagan priest]

To pull two examples, both the ghaele and the gold dragon get to cast clerical spells, and both are listed as getting to use spells from certain domains as clerical spells. No mention is made of gaining the domain special abilities, only of treating them as extensions of the clerical spell list. I think that it is fairly safe to say that they do not gain the special abilities from those domains.

On the other hand, both of these are good creatures able to cast clerical spells. The gold dragon at least is casting spells as a sorcerer, one who just happens to get spells from the clerical list, so I think that there is no question, they don't memorise any spells, so swapping is not a consideration. The ghaele is described as casting as a cleric and good aligned clerics get to swap prepared spells for cure wound spells. I see no harm in allowing this. Just remember that they need to prepare any other spells that they intend to cast.

 

[ruleslawyer]

I'd say the gold dragon would clearly not be able to spontaneously use cure or inflict spells, but that the ghaele would.

Reasoning: The dragon's description states that it may cast spells from the cleric spell list and domain spell lists "as arcane spells." As I understand it, this means that the dragon simply has a wider list of spells to choose from in determining its spells known as a sorcerer. IMHO, this specifically precludes swapping out a spell for a cure or inflict spell.

The ghaele, OTOH, casts spells "as a 14th-level cleric" with access to various domains. This suggests that the ghaele, in casting those spells "as a... cleric" would have the ability to swap them out for cure or inflict spells.

Moreover, the rules for spontaneous cleric casting would get awfully confusing with the arrival of Savage Species, which allows monsters that cast as an x-level caster to stack their natural casting ability with levels in the appropriate casting class to determine their actual spellcasting ability. If you decided that ghaele eladrins could only swap out spell slots gained from "real" cleric levels to cast cure or inflict spells, you'd have a bookkeeping nightmare on your hands.

 

[hammymchamham]

Thanks everyone. I haven't asked my DM for his opinion, but if he goes with the answer of "No" I have some ammunition on my Ghaele's side.

 

[Pagan priest]

I'd say the gold dragon would clearly not be able to spontaneously use cure or inflict spells, but that the ghaele would.

Reasoning: The dragon's description states that it may cast spells from the cleric spell list and domain spell lists "as arcane spells." As I understand it, this means that the dragon simply has a wider list of spells to choose from in determining its spells known as a sorcerer. IMHO, this specifically precludes swapping out a spell for a cure or inflict spell.

All dragons cast arcane spells as sorcerers therefore require no preperation for any of their spells. Even those that are normaly clerical spells or clerical domain spells.

Of course, sorcerers have a limited number of spells known, a limit that dragons are forced to share. The gold dragon may be in a position to decide whether to learn Cure Serious Wounds, Magic Circle Against Chaos, or Fireball.