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<blockquote data-quote="ECMO3" data-source="post: 8708141" data-attributes="member: 7030563">I don't necessarily agree that the feat or fighting style are not optimal.&nbsp; They are not optimal in terms of sustained DPR, but they do offer options that would not otherwise available, recharge on a short rest and offer both control options and a better Nova.On the character I am using them on (multiclassed Arcane Archer/Arcane Trickster) I think they are better than an ASI and archery would be.&nbsp; There are a ton of options I can use to start a fight.For exampel, once I have extra attack in a Nova first turn of combat I can take one enemy out with Hideous laughter, hit another with arcane shot, both slowing him down and damaging him further if he moves, use menacing attack to keep another enemy from closing with us and sneak attack with quick toss.&nbsp; That is a lot, a lot of hit rolls and a lot of saves, but if all of that lands that is probably 3 enemies that probably are out of the fight for a turn (and one potentially more) and a final enemy I landed sneak attack on.&nbsp; I could not hope to accomplish that with archery and an ASI.&nbsp; That is nova, but most of those resources I get back on a short rest.Another alternative is to blow my pipes of haunting, anyone who saves hit with hideous laughter, then quick toss sneak attack someone.Or I could just action surge, quick toss and make a bunch of attacks with bonuses for Grasping arrow, Menacing Attack and quick toss.I would do more consistent weapon damage with archery and an ASI no doubt, but I would not have as many varied options.</blockquote>

[QUOTE="ECMO3, post: 8708141, member: 7030563"] I don't necessarily agree that the feat or fighting style are not optimal. They are not optimal in terms of sustained DPR, but they do offer options that would not otherwise available, recharge on a short rest and offer both control options and a better Nova. On the character I am using them on (multiclassed Arcane Archer/Arcane Trickster) I think they are better than an ASI and archery would be. There are a ton of options I can use to start a fight. For exampel, once I have extra attack in a Nova first turn of combat I can take one enemy out with Hideous laughter, hit another with arcane shot, both slowing him down and damaging him further if he moves, use menacing attack to keep another enemy from closing with us and sneak attack with quick toss. That is a lot, a lot of hit rolls and a lot of saves, but if all of that lands that is probably 3 enemies that probably are out of the fight for a turn (and one potentially more) and a final enemy I landed sneak attack on. I could not hope to accomplish that with archery and an ASI. That is nova, but most of those resources I get back on a short rest. Another alternative is to blow my pipes of haunting, anyone who saves hit with hideous laughter, then quick toss sneak attack someone. Or I could just action surge, quick toss and make a bunch of attacks with bonuses for Grasping arrow, Menacing Attack and quick toss. I would do more consistent weapon damage with archery and an ASI no doubt, but I would not have as many varied options. [/QUOTE]

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