guns, magic and swords oh my! Fadings Suns and Deadlands D20's..

[paulewaug]

So both of these sound good,
Fading Suns d20
and
Deadlands d20

I've read the officail reviews and they are good but I know there have to be more people around here that have it and haven't done an official review.

So
What do you guys think of both of these games.
How are the combat rules, gun rules, and Magic rules for both
of them?


Also how hard would it be to use either of them slightly out of context with their own fluff and make your own
Six guns and Sorcery
or tech and magic kind of games?

Could you use Deadlands to do a Victorian England-ish setting game (like the movie Bram Stoker's Dracula) with western cowboy types facing victorian or gothic evils outside of the Wild West around that time period (also like "the Mummy") and maybe something like "The Dark Tower" by Stephen King?
Pesky Americans popping up as adventurers all over the world anyhow!! hehe


For Fading Suns I would like it for Fantasy SciFi but so far I'm not that interested in Dragonstar...
So is it kind of Dune meets StarWars?
Could you drop the space travel out of it completely?!

Just some ideas to kick around before I decide if I should drop the cash on these two games...thanks!

If you vote please explain what you liked or didn't like!?

 

[Cheerio]

I didn't vote, since I do not know anything about the Deadlands. FS, however, I think I have most of the original
system's books (not the d20 though).

What's terrific about FS is the setting. If you are going to make your own setting, pass this baby, since - at least
the original Victory Point System is nothing to write home about (though it has certain nice features in it).

Fading Suns is little like Dune. It also has clear influence from Gene Wolfe's Books of the New Sun novels.
Add a lot of religious schisms, noble houses, aliens, mysterious ancient items, psionics, fading stars,
more strange aliens, lotsa intrigue and shake well.

Also, check Holistic Design's homepage: www.holistic-design.com/FS/FSmain.htm

There's some basic info about the setting and some short stories
("My time among the stars" - colelcted Alustaro's journals).

If this gets you going, check also fan-based short stories from here (some of them are incredibly good,
especially recommended are "Glory to the Mantis" and its "sequel" "Inshallah burning"): www.fadingsuns.de/

And it shouldn't be difficult to game in FS without any space travelling. There is actually a book about worlds that have been
cut-off from the Known Worlds, it's called Lost Worlds: Star Crusade 2 (no, you do not need Star Crusade 1 for it).
It's currently only available from VPS system.

Hope this helps.

Cheers.

 

[kengar]

Could you use Deadlands to do a Victorian England-ish setting game (like the movie Bram Stoker's Dracula) with western cowboy types facing victorian or gothic evils outside of the Wild West around that time period (also like "the Mummy") and maybe something like "The Dark Tower" by Stephen King?

Heck, you can do this with CoC.

 

[Tsyr]

Other. I love FS, both D20 and non... The original system for Deadlands is really bad, IMO, but the setting itself, and it's D20 incarnation, is just sorta... there. It's not bad, but it's not really that good either, IMHO.

 

[nsruf]

I don't know about Deadlands, but FS isn't done very well, rules-wise (in either the original or d20 edition). The setting itself is interesting, though. But if you are mainly interested in the rules, there ought to be better games to "loot" (StarWars probably, although I haven't seen it).

 

[paulewaug]

Thanks for all the info so far,

@Cheerio- Thanks for all the info, I am checking out those links right now. My FLGS has the original VPS version but my group likes their d20 so it will be easier to get them to try new stuff if they Basically already know How to play!

It sounds like it rich with atmosphere, How Combat Heavy can it be?
They like to fight...(Although in our last session all their 2nd-3rd level D&D characters got to fight against were @20 goblins and 3 Hobgoblins..hehe...but they Were still roughed up from the previous sessions battle with a Mummy)

@kengar-
I wonder if CoC would fit in with either of these games, maybe as a creature Sourcebook? I like CoC but doubt the group would enjoy it much. That is why I think I would have better luck doing Victorian Cowboys over the Gaslight Investigators, they are pretty gung-ho and would enjoy wipping out some weapons and killing the bad guy rather than going crazy and dying or droolling away in Arkham Asylum! heh
They are more the Evil Dead/Army of Darkness types rather than the HP Lovecraft types, and I kinda am too most of the time!

@Tsyr- I used to have the original Deadlands, I got it when it first came out. I liked the drawing of cards to make characters aspect for the unusual fun it brought in but the rules were kinda screwy (the more low sided dice you could roll the better off you probably would be, eh). I gave the book to one of my then gaming buddies and we long ago parted company.
But the d20 version sounded decent and I like the western style characters but don't know that I want to run a truly western style game (although something sort of like Jon Shannow by David Gemmil could be fun perhaps. And like I said maybe a little like the Dark Tower books.)
I was really thinking about maybe a Fantasy game with firearms that have advanced past muskets and into repeating rifles and six-guns. I had even thought about running something possibly set in the Iron Kingdoms but a ways further into the future than the IK's curent time period. Could keep the monsters and somewhat Feudal system and have more advanced firearms and a growing Train/Railroad system. I Think it would all fit in well with the Steamjacks and such and still have much of the areas wild and populated by strange creatures. The hard part of course would be to keep it as much of a Fantasy atmosphere and/or steampunk as possible but not being a Spaghetti western.

Thanks to all for the responses so far!

 

[paulewaug]

I don't know about Deadlands, but FS isn't done very well, rules-wise (in either the original or d20 edition). The setting itself is interesting, though. But if you are mainly interested in the rules, there ought to be better games to "loot" (StarWars probably, although I haven't seen it).

Thanks nsruf!
I had thought about using a converted Starwars game but the Force is kinda..."hinky"..IMHO (well not as in the context of "Starwars and the Force" but in the context of trying to pass it off as something other than what it really is)
I just didn't feel I could really seperate the so called 'crunchy' stuff from the not so crunchy. And I don't know What I would do with a Starwars campaign...Even though realistically ruleswise there may not be a lot of difference between the 2.

But if both me and my players new it was Starwars, it would be Starwars. Jedis etc..
Fading Suns offers them something mysterious and new.

Thanks for the info though! I probably better find a way to get my hands on the book before I buy it, ruleswise I could always just maybe waite for d20 Modern.

So far FS is sounding good though, the atmopshere sounds rich enough I would probably just get swept up in it and use it 'as-is'.
It is good to hear from someone who Does Not care for the game though as I need to know the good and the bad.

 

[Cheerio]

How combat heavy can FS be?

Well, it depends. =) If you're playing a military unit in the
Symbiot-ridden planet of Stigmata, then fighting is almost every-day.

On the other hand, if you're hanging around the Holy Terra,
I'd say intrigue is a-plenty, but straight-out combat is quite rare.

Your call, though. And Symbiots are not the only things to wave
your sword against (or gun, or whatever). There are always pirates,
space barbarians ("Vuldrok"), heretics ("Kurgan"), competing noble houses,
strange aliens, fanatic priests, Dark between the Stars (tm), Husks (~zombies) etc.

The d20 bestiary is coming out soon(?), so you'd have more strange animals
and aliens to throw against your players. Make sure to check out also d20 Aliens &
Deviltry - it combines two VPS sourcebooks (Children of the Gods - book about
two alien races Ur-Obun and Ur-Ukar and The Dark between the Stars - contains
all sort of nifty things a GM needs to darken the campaign with, such as Demons,
Antinomists, Void Krakens etc. )

Cheers.

 

[paulewaug]

Thanks Cheerio,
this is really sounding pretty interesting too me

I like that there seems to be plenty of setting to cover different gaming styles.

 

[Cheerio]

It's been a pleasure.

In my own campaign in FS has had a couple of fights with a local Scravers,
once there were problem with some Husks and PCs are trying not to
get messed up with Church politics or with Avestite fanatics.

And if you wind up getting Fading Suns and you seem a little lost with it,
drop a note to Fading Suns mailing list (I think the link is http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Fading_Suns_Games/ )
and ask your questions - there's quite a few FS old timers there, who can
provide nice answers, though the list been awfully quiet for the last few months.

Cheers.