Half-levels of Speak Language
- Thread starter Warehouse23
- Start date
Warehouse23
First Post
Excellent. Thanks, all. It was a bit of a brain fart on whole spending multiple points per level thing. I get so used to having maxed out skills (keeping my wizard's craft: blacksmithing as high as I like it is expensive) that I forget about that.
Patryn of Elvenshae
First Post
But, Craft is a class skill for Wizards ...
Warehouse23
First Post
That was my point--that being accustomed to keeping class skills maxed out means one is prone to forget the details of improving cc skills.
Patryn of Elvenshae
First Post
Gotcha! 
heirodule
First Post
My unimplemented house rules for languages
Rudimentary Language
For all classes except bard, Speak Language is a Cross-Class skill taking two points. If only one point is spent on a language, the character is considered to have rudimentary understanding of a language, knowing a limited vocabulary and very few grammatical rules. He will be able to understand a speaker only by making an intelligence check. The difficulty class is as follows:
DC: 10 Speaker is attempting to speak in simple terms to aid understanding
DC: 15 Normal conversation
DC: 20 Speaker is deliberately confusing understanding.
DC: +5 Inherently complex or difficult subject
DC: -5 conversation on the following subjects: language fluency, food and drink, insults, learning names, locating conveniences.
If the DC is failed by more than 5, the listener has misunderstood the speakers statement in a way which reverses or changes the meaning in a deleterious manner. A DC 15 + failed check difference Will Save will alert the character to the potential of his mistake before acting on it.
The same DC applies to a character with rudimentary language attempting to communicate with a proficient speaker. The proficient character will not be confused by mistakes made by the speaker but will merely fail to gain knowledge of what was conveyed.
Speaking a rudimentary language in combat is move-equivalent action instead of a free action.
When reading, rudimentary language knowledge will be useless unless the speaker is proficient in a language in the same alphabet as the rudimentary language. If the alphabet is known, then the same DCs apply to understand any given text up to 20 pages in length. 5 ranks in Decipher Script will give a +2 synergy bonus modifer to the intelligence check to understand the text.
Skill checks DCs that are affected by rudimentary language
Diplomacy checks DC +5;
Innuendo checks DC +10
Rudimentary Common
The "common tongue" is frequently understood as a "trade language" that most people know in addition to any local dialect that they are native speakers of. To better reflect this understanding, the following rules are used:
All character are proficient in their racial language (if non-human) or human dialect and know common only rudimentarily. It still takes 2 full skill points to learn common at a "proficient" level, or proficient common may be selected as one of the bonus languages for high intelligence.
Any given race designated as speaking common in the core rules has a 20% chance of not speaking it at all, a 50% chance of speaking it only rudimentarily, and a 30% chance of speaking it proficiently. In non-urban ares the probabilities are 40% non-speakers, 50% rudimentary speakers and 10% speakers. Innkeepers, merchants and authorities are always at least rudimentary speakers. There is only a 20% chance that any native of an uncivilized area is a rudimentary speaker of common
some other ideas
Special Languages
Abyssal
Initimidation checks in Abyssal are at +2. Speakers receive a -2 to will saves versus demons.
Aquan
This language can be spoken underwater without penalty.
Auran
Speakers of this language may communicate at ultreasonic freqencies, adding 10 to the listen check.
Celestial
It is impossible for mortals to lie when speaking this tongue.
Draconic
+2 circumstance bonus to spellcraft checks for verbal spells and deciphering scrolls.
Druidic
Oaths taken in druidic (voluntary and with full knowledge) have the effect of a Geas for nonperformance
Rudimentary Language
For all classes except bard, Speak Language is a Cross-Class skill taking two points. If only one point is spent on a language, the character is considered to have rudimentary understanding of a language, knowing a limited vocabulary and very few grammatical rules. He will be able to understand a speaker only by making an intelligence check. The difficulty class is as follows:
DC: 10 Speaker is attempting to speak in simple terms to aid understanding
DC: 15 Normal conversation
DC: 20 Speaker is deliberately confusing understanding.
DC: +5 Inherently complex or difficult subject
DC: -5 conversation on the following subjects: language fluency, food and drink, insults, learning names, locating conveniences.
If the DC is failed by more than 5, the listener has misunderstood the speakers statement in a way which reverses or changes the meaning in a deleterious manner. A DC 15 + failed check difference Will Save will alert the character to the potential of his mistake before acting on it.
The same DC applies to a character with rudimentary language attempting to communicate with a proficient speaker. The proficient character will not be confused by mistakes made by the speaker but will merely fail to gain knowledge of what was conveyed.
Speaking a rudimentary language in combat is move-equivalent action instead of a free action.
When reading, rudimentary language knowledge will be useless unless the speaker is proficient in a language in the same alphabet as the rudimentary language. If the alphabet is known, then the same DCs apply to understand any given text up to 20 pages in length. 5 ranks in Decipher Script will give a +2 synergy bonus modifer to the intelligence check to understand the text.
Skill checks DCs that are affected by rudimentary language
Diplomacy checks DC +5;
Innuendo checks DC +10
Rudimentary Common
The "common tongue" is frequently understood as a "trade language" that most people know in addition to any local dialect that they are native speakers of. To better reflect this understanding, the following rules are used:
All character are proficient in their racial language (if non-human) or human dialect and know common only rudimentarily. It still takes 2 full skill points to learn common at a "proficient" level, or proficient common may be selected as one of the bonus languages for high intelligence.
Any given race designated as speaking common in the core rules has a 20% chance of not speaking it at all, a 50% chance of speaking it only rudimentarily, and a 30% chance of speaking it proficiently. In non-urban ares the probabilities are 40% non-speakers, 50% rudimentary speakers and 10% speakers. Innkeepers, merchants and authorities are always at least rudimentary speakers. There is only a 20% chance that any native of an uncivilized area is a rudimentary speaker of common
some other ideas
Special Languages
Abyssal
Initimidation checks in Abyssal are at +2. Speakers receive a -2 to will saves versus demons.
Aquan
This language can be spoken underwater without penalty.
Auran
Speakers of this language may communicate at ultreasonic freqencies, adding 10 to the listen check.
Celestial
It is impossible for mortals to lie when speaking this tongue.
Draconic
+2 circumstance bonus to spellcraft checks for verbal spells and deciphering scrolls.
Druidic
Oaths taken in druidic (voluntary and with full knowledge) have the effect of a Geas for nonperformance
heirodule,
Do you allow spending more sp in speak language? That is can someone have the equivalent of greater than 1 rank?
If not then I don't see how they can reasonably make some of those DCs.
If so then an awful lot of sp msut be spent in order to get anywhere. Each language would have its own ranks and cost 2 sp (or 1 for class skills) but that doesn't guarantee fluency since that requires a skill check of at least 10.
Also why a Wil save? This would more logically be a Wisdom Check. A will save benefits classes with a strong will save modifier (like wizards) non-proportionaltey.
Do you allow spending more sp in speak language? That is can someone have the equivalent of greater than 1 rank?
If not then I don't see how they can reasonably make some of those DCs.
If so then an awful lot of sp msut be spent in order to get anywhere. Each language would have its own ranks and cost 2 sp (or 1 for class skills) but that doesn't guarantee fluency since that requires a skill check of at least 10.
Also why a Wil save? This would more logically be a Wisdom Check. A will save benefits classes with a strong will save modifier (like wizards) non-proportionaltey.
It is often the case that Gnoll characters ahve to invest 2 of their very few points to learn common, which is not a base language. Obviously, very few characters speak gnoll. Only if base Int = 14+(-2 Race for 12+) can a PC Gnoll start with common (which then means that 3 skill points need to be spent in a cross-class skill).
Shin Okada
Explorer
My previous cleric PC took Celestial by spending 2 skill points to communicate with summoned celestial creatures.
In current campaign I am DMing, a PC Spellthief learned the language of an enemy race in the middle of campaign. That is a new race created by the author of that adventure trilogy. So no one knew the existence of that language until they actually met those creatures.
In current campaign I am DMing, a PC Spellthief learned the language of an enemy race in the middle of campaign. That is a new race created by the author of that adventure trilogy. So no one knew the existence of that language until they actually met those creatures.
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