Handle Animal Skill

dreaded_beast

First Post
If I understand correctly, Handle Animal allows you to train and rear a "pet".

Using this skill, I would assume a PC could gain a pet follower.

How many pets could a PC gain in this manner?

What are the limitations?

From my understanding, I assume this is a "weaker" version of a ranger/druid's "animal companion". Along those lines, could a ranger/druid add pets in addition to his animal companions? (Granted the pets gained using the Handle Animal skill would not be on par with the animal companion)

How would having a pet gained through this skill affect the effective Party Level in terms of gaining XP?

How does this affect the Leadership feat?
 

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dreaded_beast said:
If I understand correctly, Handle Animal allows you to train and rear a "pet".

Using this skill, I would assume a PC could gain a pet follower.

How many pets could a PC gain in this manner?

What are the limitations?

From my understanding, I assume this is a "weaker" version of a ranger/druid's "animal companion". Along those lines, could a ranger/druid add pets in addition to his animal companions? (Granted the pets gained using the Handle Animal skill would not be on par with the animal companion)

How would having a pet gained through this skill affect the effective Party Level in terms of gaining XP?

How does this affect the Leadership feat?

I would say the PC could have as many animals as he wants, keeping in mind the length of time it takes to train each animal. I don't belive there are any limitations.

A pet gained in this manner would probably have little or no impact on Party Level, unless the party is very low in level. Even then, I wouldn't count it against the Party Level in terms of xp, the same way a summond monster doesn't add to the partys level.

I suppose if you take Leadership, your cohort could be an animal that you have trained up who gains levels and becomes more powerful as time progresses. In this instance, the animal then takes a full share in xp and is added to the party level.

In my opinion at least, this is what I would do.
 

dreaded_beast said:
Granted the pets gained using the Handle Animal skill would not be on par with the animal companion
Depends. Nothing stops a low-level character from having a tyrannosaurus if he can acquire one. (As long as someone else has reared it, I suppose, as the DC for that is 33. Or get a domesticated one - it's probably possible in some races/cultures. :p)
Might a bit expensive even if you can get one, but...

'course, having animals with you (especially big and/or dangerous ones - or lots of smaller ones) is not allowed everywhere.

By the way, feeding a horde of animals might (constantly) cost quite a bit, especially if they need lots of meat.
 

I suppose if you take Leadership, your cohort could be an animal that you have trained up who gains levels and becomes more powerful as time progresses. In this instance, the animal then takes a full share in xp and is added to the party level.

A cohort does not take a share of XP or add to party level. A cohort gains XP only when the leader gains XP, in the amount of cohort level/leader level X leader XP, but it doesn't count as a "share." In a party of three characters and one cohort, XP is divided by three among the characters and the cohort gains Xp according to its leader. So if a 6th-level character with Leadership gains 600 xp, the 4th-level cohort gains (400/600) x 600 XP = 400 XP. This is covered in the DMG, don't recall the page #.

Using this skill, I would assume a PC could gain a pet follower.

How many pets could a PC gain in this manner?

What are the limitations?

The limitation is that it's a move action to handle an animal (ie give it a command) or a full-round action to push an animal (give it a command it hasn't been specifically trained). A druid or ranger can handle his or her animal companion as a free action or push the animal companion as a move action.

You can have a pack of wild dogs trained to attack, but it takes a move action to command them to attack. And those wild dogs aren't going to gain any animal companion benefits, so you'd probably be replacing dogs after every encounter as you gain levels.

I think it would affect party level in the same way that a cohort does. That is, technically it doesn't affect party level, but you'll probably have to eyeball it and determine if you should adjust your average party level 1 higher. It shouldn't affect party level more than that.
 

Those animals will be great for things like guarding your fort (dogs and geese), sending messages (carrier piegons), presenting as gifts to lords or vassals (horses, warhorses, ponies), tracking (bloodhounds), and sport (falcons, pointers, retreivers [not the abyssal kind] :))

But the biggest limitation for these guys is that they'll never have more than a few HD, and that means quick death at higher levels. They're better off being pitted against small mundane foes they can handle and accompanied by the followers you'll attract with your Leadership feat.

Otherwise, they shouldn't have any effect on XP, Cohorts, or Followers.
 

You are right, cohorts don't count for a full share of XP...Divide cohort's level by the level of the PC who attracted the cohort, multiply this result by the total XP awarded to the PC and add that to the cohorts XP. DMG 104

Sorry, and I may be wrong about adding the cohort to your Party Level for determining encounters as well, but I can't find it in the DMG right now.
 

The general rule of thumb is that a feat or class ability never raises the average party level or CR/EL of an encounter. Since the cohort is gained from a feat, it shouldn't affect the average party level. It's the same reasoning why defeating a creature summoned by an evil wizard doesn't net you any more XP, because the ability to summon the creature is already factored into the wizard's CR.

Now, hiring a boatload of mercenaries is a different matter ...
 

Felix said:
But the biggest limitation for these guys is that they'll never have more than a few HD
That depends on the animal in question. A dire bear has 12 HD (and specimens up to 36 HD are quite possible). Dire tigers and some dinosaurs have even more.

Even if size is a problem, dire tigers up to 32 HD are merely Large.
 

The primary limitations are 1) Skill, 2) Time, and 3) Cash

Animals need feeding - "Feed" is listed in the SRD under Equipment/Goods And Services at 5 cp/day, 10 lbs/day for Horses, Donkeys, Mules, et cetera; for Carnivores, chunks of meat are listed at 3 sp per 1/2 lb (if you have a lot of carnivores (or a few big carnivores), you are probably better off buying mules or donkies and slaughtering them yourself).

Pretending any Large herbavore eats the same as a horse, you can scale fairly easily - a size class (usually approximates as x2 in each dimension) works out to a * or / 8 (mass) for each size class up or down (probably use 4 for food intake, as it doesn't scale perfectly with mass) - so a Huge herbavore would need 40 lbs of feed a day (2 sp), a medium: 2.5 lbs (1.25 cp).

Carnivores are harder to judge, of course, as game-mechanics don't include a baseline for comparison - if, however, we assume that a Large Carnivore needs the same mass of meat as a Large Herbavore needs feed, then your medium Wolf needs 2.5 lbs of meat a day (1.5 gp), while your Large Dire Tiger needs 10 lbs of meat a day (6 gp); as I mentioned - you will probably be better off buying a Donkey every few days (8 gp each) to feed your Dire Tiger.

Also, there is a problem with raising animals - with a DC of 15 + Animal's HD, a character (cha 16, Animal Affinity, max ranks in Handle Animal, for this example) can't reliably (take 10 succeeds) rear wild animals with more than 3 HD than the character has levels (8 hd for level 5, 13HD for level 10, and so on). Moreover, exotic animal cubs are very difficult or very expensive to get - if you can take a Dire Tiger's cubs away in relative safety, those grown-up Dire Tigers won't be too terribly much help.... even if you can raise them safely. For the same reason, exotic animal cubs would be expensive - they are hard to get, and difficult to train. Call it 50 gp * CR(of the final animal) ^ 2, for the cubs; that would be 200 for a heavy warhorse "cub", 800 gp for a tiger cub, 450 gp for a Huge Viper "cub", 3200 gp for a Dire Tiger cub.

It's extremely unlikely that the grown versions would be available already domesticated, due to the difficulty of raising them - how much does it cost to hire a skilled trainer, especially one who can reliably raise the more difficult creatures, as hired NPC's usually don't have big stat bonuses (usually just the minimum needed to cast the spell with spellcasters) for the time it takes one of the more difficult creatures to grow up (how many years does it take a normal tiger to reach adulthood? Two, three years? Four?)? A max-rank NPC with Animal Affinity and no stat bonus is only going to be able to rear an animal (Level + 3 + 2 (AA) + 10 (for take 10) = Level + 15; DC 15 -> Reliably of the NPC's level) of the NPC's level or less in HD. Let's see.... at 3 sp * level^2 per day, a level-1 trainer costs 365*3 sp = 1095 sp/year. A three-year critter with 10 final HD would thus cost 328,500 sp, or 32,850 gp for rearing alone. Three of the same kind can be done simultaneously (and thus you can divide the cost by 3 for a "professional" exotic animal rearer), but that is still 10,950 gp rearing costs for a 10 HD animal - and that doesn't include the cost of the cub itself, nor the feeding of that cub.

Just in case you want to tone down a Player who wants lots of pets, or if you need to discuss things with a GM to ensure that you can have a few.
 

Pets & Sidekicks

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