Harry Potter and the Chamber of Secrets

[Pielorinho]

Where I am truely surprised is how many adults have read and liked the books. The books may be good, but these movies do not motivate me to read them. These movies seem the same level as the Goonies, but instead of pirates, it is wizards.

I love children's books: from the Prydain Chronicles through the Dark is Rising series, from His Dark Materials through Lemony Snicket, I read lots of kid's fantasy, and always have.

Rowling is good, no question, but she's far from the best IMO. I think Lloyd Alexander is the most skillful morality-play writer (inasmuch as the morals are very well hidden and very germane to the rollicking adventure); Roald Dahl is a much funnier author; and Phillip Pullman just blows everyone away as a creator of a bizarre but wholly believable world.

Lots of folks, obviously, disagree with me . I recommend reading Rowling's books -- they certainly are entertaining -- but don't expect something as earth-shatteringly brilliant as Charlie and the Chocolate Factory.

Daniel

 

[Storm Raven]

Never read the books, but my wife has. We went saturday (11-16-02) and the place was, of course, sold out. I found the movie to be very strong. Witty, with a really good story and great visuals. Some of the highpoints being the castle itself (almost a character unto itself), the curious book that harry finds, and the chamber itself. The ending was good, but led me to a question that I got a slightly disappointing answer to...


SPOILERS AHEAD!!!
/
/
/
/
/
/
/
/
/
/
/
/
/
/
/ LAST CHANCE!
/
/
/
/
/
/
/
/
/
I asked my wife if Voldemort (sp?) was the ultimate antagonist in all of the books. Unfortunately, my wife said "yes". It will not ruin the movies for me, but it does detract a little when it's always the same villain behind the subterfuge.

Yeah, it was real horrible when I found out that Sauron, of all people, was behind all the villany in LotR. And that Arawn was the root cause of all the badness in the Chronicles and Prydain, and . . .

You get the idea.

 

[KnowTheToe]

Phillip Pullman just blows everyone away as a creator of a bizarre but wholly believable world.

[/i].

Daniel

I have also read a lot of childrens literature. Pullman's work was awe inspiring until the third book where it starts to get preachy. I would recommend fully anyone read the first 2 books. I warn you, you will want to read the third and IMO, it was a pile of crap.

 

[Michael Tree]

You are corrrect in assuming that the problems you bring up were created by the moviemakers, not by Rowling. They all make sense in the book, but were poorly executed or explained in the movie.

The beginning scene with the car was totally unneccessary to the story.
It detracted immediately from the film.
If they had brain one in their heads, they never would have been in danger from the train.

IIRC, those were invented for the movie, and serve no purpose. In the book, they only start having trouble when they start to run out of gas near Hogwarts.

And the car-as-deus-ex-machina I could not BELIEVE!
I was literally jaw-dropping shocked that they brought that stupid CAR in to save them after filming themselves into a corner with the spiders.

That's actually from the book, though the spider scene was different. In the book it makes it clearer that the car has become sentient, and is doing them a favour out of a sense of loyalty.

And the spiders!!
Oh my goodness, was that a HUGE mistake.
I don't know ehere to begin with that problem, so I'll leave that to the obvious problems it presents.

In the book there is only one giant spider, and he hides in the depths of the forest with a ton of normal spiders. In the book it also makes it clearer that Hagrid is a softie when it comes to his creatures, not believing that they are harmful to others.

The muppet of the huge spider was also too fake looking.

Moving on, the charlatan instructor (briilliantly played by Branagh) was a big problem over time.
Not only was he incompetent as an instructor (why would they have hired this man??!!), but he was evil as well.
He mind-wiped other wizards who he stole the stories from, and would have done so to the kids??

While Branagh was brilliant, the direction was ham-fisted, making it obvious from the beginning that Lockhart is incompetent, while in the books that only comes out gradually.

Seriuously flawed to the point that I don't understand how anybody can miss these. Maybe reading the book makes it all different, but when talking about a FILM, you should always be commenting on what they put on screeen, not what was written on the page in the book.

We missed them because we've read the book and understand the context. Not that you should have to have read the book to understand the movie, but that's the way it is.

--- having a Ghost - Moaning Myrtle - be so annoying that they have to shut down parts of the school

They didn't shut down the bathroom, people just avoided it because Myrtle is annoying.

having the Basilisk be so large, yet noone saw/heard it moving around other than Harry?

Firstly, it wasn't that huge in the book. Second, it moved around through the pipes in the walls (though the movie neglects to mention this). That's why Harry heard voices in the walls.

many more, but those are the problems which threw me and my wife coimpletely out of enjoying the wonder of the fantasy elements they included, and started making us ask, "Why are those elements there?"

Because the director is a hollywood hack? This movie had many good points, but also suffered from most of the flaws that made the first movie hopelessly mediocre.

 

[Storm Raven]

Firstly, it wasn't that huge in the book. Second, it moved around through the pipes in the walls (though the movie neglects to mention this). That's why Harry heard voices in the walls.

Actually, they do comment on this in the movie. They quite clearly state that the basilisk has been using Hogwart's pipe system to move around the school.

 

[reapersaurus]

Michael Tree - nice to hear from you again, and nice to have somebody TRY to explain the baffling mistakes in the film.

About the basilisk sneaking around - I hope you don't swallow the idea of a 60 ft snake sneaking thru the school's pipes.

What was shown in the movie was one entrance (the huge fountain). There is NO WAY any pipes are large enough to allow that monstrosity to travel thru them.

About Moaning Myrtle:
I was getting at the idea that the first film presented the ghosts as being a cool ADDITION to the school:
the 2nd film is making it seem like the ghosts are an IRRITATION.

Not something that is very smart to allow on your grounds.
(Now, I'm aware that they may feel some sense of guilt about MM, but it's still a very bad idea to undermine the coolness of the ghosts on campus by showing a non-beneficial one on screen.)

About the spiders: so the movie needlessly RUINED the entire concept of the spiders?!
Sheesh - and here I was, losing some of my hatred for that hack director.

I have MANY more problems I wrote out about the film, if anyone would like to discuss or hear.

Michael - I'm interested - what DID the film do well?

On my list, the only thing I liked was the idea of wizards dueling, and the racism/classism angle.

 

[Pielorinho]

I have also read a lot of childrens literature. Pullman's work was awe inspiring until the third book where it starts to get preachy. I would recommend fully anyone read the first 2 books. I warn you, you will want to read the third and IMO, it was a pile of crap.

Not to hijack too much, but I disagree: I thought the third book of the series was the most powerful of the three. True, it does portray a world pretty hostile to religion, and you can definitely hear Pullman's voice coming through -- but it works very well as fiction.

Daniel

 

[Storm Raven]

About the basilisk sneaking around - I hope you don't swallow the idea of a 60 ft snake sneaking thru the school's pipes.

What was shown in the movie was one entrance (the huge fountain). There is NO WAY any pipes are large enough to allow that monstrosity to travel thru them.

It is a magical creature. Could it not change size perhaps? It isn't stated, but it is a creature clearly powered by magic, like the phoenix (who shows up because Harry is "loyal" to Dumbeldore), who knows what its size changing powers might be. Besides, Hogworts clearly has unusual architecture, I could easily accept the idea that is had a bunch of large pipes throughout its structure.

About Moaning Myrtle:
I was getting at the idea that the first film presented the ghosts as being a cool ADDITION to the school:
the 2nd film is making it seem like the ghosts are an IRRITATION.

They can't be both? The ghosts are just dead people. Are there not people who are irritations in your world, as well as people who are additions?

 

[Enchantress]

umm... this movie sucked.

These opinions are coming from a couple who have not read the books, but appreciated the fantasy elements of the first movie.

KnowtheToe and others have only mentioned a couple of the HUGE problems the 2nd movie has, but those only scratch the surface.

Our guess is that they are now glossing over many areas of the book that are required for understanding WEHY things happen in the movie.
that is unfortunate, though expected.
Many movies do this with popular books.
It's disappointing that they accomplished this tough task (not requiring the reading of the book to enjoy/understand the movie) with the first, but not the 2nd.

I'll quote Crothian, I think first:ya, it seemed rushed, and interminably long at the same time.
This movie was over 2 1/2 hours long!! I was shocked, and after an hour and a quarter, it was seeming long to my wife.

The beginning scene with the car was totally unneccessary to the story.
It detracted immediately from the film.
If they had brain one in their heads, they never would have been in danger from the train.

And the car-as-deus-ex-machina I could not BELIEVE!
I was literally jaw-dropping shocked that they brought that stupid CAR in to save them after filming themselves into a corner with the spiders.

And the spiders!!
Oh my goodness, was that a HUGE mistake.
I don't know ehere to begin with that problem, so I'll leave that to the obvious problems it presents.

Moving on, the charlatan instructor (briilliantly played by Branagh) was a big problem over time.
Not only was he incompetent as an instructor (why would they have hired this man??!!), but he was evil as well.
He mind-wiped other wizards who he stole the stories from, and would have done so to the kids??

But he was stupid enough to call out a real wizard (Snape) for the duel so that he could get his butt kicked?
That whole scene was flawed.
Seriuously flawed to the point that I don't understand how anybody can miss these.

Maybe reading the book makes it all different, but when talking about a FILM, you should always be commenting on what they put on screeen, not what was written on the page in the book.

And there's more problems i don't have time for:
--- having a Ghost - Moaning Myrtle - be so annoying that they have to shut down parts of the school
-- having the Basilisk be so large, yet noone saw/heard it moving around other than Harry?
-- the stupid cursed-ball destroying major parts of the schholgrounds, probably killing multiple students if they were realistic, yet the 2nd year student has power to stop it??!! WTF??

many more, but those are the problems which threw me and my wife coimpletely out of enjoying the wonder of the fantasy elements they included, and started making us ask, "Why are those elements there?"

Damn, but you are hard to please!!!!!!
First of all, what movie do you honestly (repeat: honestly) know of that is perfect? And you have never even read the books!! You should know that movies always suck more than the book!
And you mentioned being bothere that lockhart was an idiot. He was supposed to be!!!!!! The whole point of his character was that he was a pretty-boy wannabe backstreet boy that got hired for completely the wrong job.
*Takes a deep breath*
I would argue more, But I have just realized that you're not worth my time.
*Sticks out her tongue and leaves haughtily*

 

[Crothian]

Hopefully she'll be back to argue more when she is calmer. That was pretty good.