help - 9 players

[Sir Draconion]

ok im running shackled city the party is 5-6 lvl
and i have gained 3 players for a total of 9 in the past 2 weeks the fights are to easy
what can i do to make things more challenging for everyone with out killing
ie what CR or how many, is there a page or rules listed

please help

 

[Jdvn1]

Play with higher CR creatures, but you'll probably have more luck adding more creatures.

 

[STARP_JVP]

Do not play with 9 players. Very very very bad idea. Killed my campaign. Bad. Icky. Eew. No.

 

[DarrenGMiller]

Since the adventures are written for 4 characters of a specific level, here is what I do. Add the level of all characters, then divide by four. That is the actual party level. Now, subtract what the adventure was written for from that number and raise the ECL's by that much. For example, the adventure was written for 4 4th level PC's. The party has 9 3th level PC's. 9 x 3 = 27 / 4 = 6.75 - 4 = 2.75, so raise each encounter by an ECL of 2 or 3. It works pretty well for me.

DM

 

[GlassJaw]

and i have gained 3 players for a total of 9 in the past 2 weeks the fights are to easy
what can i do to make things more challenging for everyone with out killing

Say no when more people want to join?

I'm running SC right now with 5 players. IMO, the campaign is pretty difficult for 4 players as-written. I like 5 players as it helps their survivability a bit and slows down advancement slightly.

Anymore than 5 players and things get too slow. People end up waiting for their turn too long.

 

[Thunderfoot]

9? I run 11 . First get help, get another person to do Game Operations & Design (G.O.D.). While this may sound counter productive, it allows you to split the reasources, problems and challenges brought on by larger groups. It also allows someone to search the books on a ruling without causing the game to stop while you do it. Increasaing number of adversaries is the easy way to increase challenge without increasing leathality. Obvious 1 to 1 ratios are the easiest but with a little practice it gets easier. (Obviously 4 1st level characters facing 4 orcs = 9 1st level characters facing 9 orcs) but what about a troll? Remember, though the numbers might work, a troll can dead a 1st level character, not the 'tother way round. But 2 - 4 orcs with a dire wolf pet, now you're talking.

If you have to at first, run the battle yourself, at home, using "templates" of your parties characters (I call them punch dummies) to see if works, have your G.O.D. roll for the party and you for the baddies, or vice versa, makes no difference and you can get a feel for how it should go. Of course lady luck can always intervene and spoil everything, but that's why we play the game.

 

[Thornir Alekeg]

I used to run a group of 8 players. Add more baddies. Adding higher CR creatures may challenge the party, but also increases the likelyhood of killing off the less combat optimal PCs. The biggest issue with this of course if that battles take forever. Be sure to implement some pretty strict rules about how much time players have to make decisions when their initiative comes up. On the other side, you as DM also have to be quick and organized.

I would not have survived without the use of my DMs familiar software. The combat board was the best for keeping track of initiative and spell durations when you have 8 PCs and a dozen foes. You don't need to put in every bit of information, and I didn't use the dice roller, I just used to to keep everything properly sequenced.

 

[Ringmereth]

Cut the group into two. 9 players is just too much. I've played in games like that, and they turn unenjoyable very quickly. When it takes half an hour to play one combat round, people don't have fun.

If you're set on the idea, though, increase both the number and difficulty of their foes. If you just add a bunch of weak opponents, they won't have as much fun-it's just more of the usual. If you up the level of everything by 3, though, they'll run into stuff that will easily take down a few characters. So, for 9 players, add perhaps 2 more opponents, each 1 or 2 levels higher, to challenge them. It helps a lot, though, to try out each encounter yourself. The CR system isn't perfect, and while you can add 5 ECLs of templates and hit dice to one creature without making it much tougher, just a few more levels on a spellcaster can mean the difference between a challenge and TPK.

Also, take a look at how intelligently you're running foes. Use good tactics, like flanking and crowd control, to make what you've got more effective. Don't target the cleric with will-save effects; use them on the fighter. A couple well-placed hold, charm, or dominate effects can also turn the tide against the party.

 

[diaglo]

20 is optimal for OD&D(1974).

 

[Sir Draconion]

thanx guys for your response
spiliting up the group will not work
only have time for one day a week plustwo of the players are sons of two others
wich can slow down the game with there antics but the fathers seem to keep them in line
i dont have a problem with running big groups or useing tacktics (i have all ready killed 4 characters)
ok lets narrow this down a little what would you do for a 9 person party 5-6 lvl party
vs Gotrrod the CR7 young red dragon in Zenith
looking at the progrestion of dragons the breath weapon plus sp. abilities gets to be TPK really fast but if i leave it alone to easy