Help! Stacking Effects!

[TheGemini]

Ok, I have a few very stubborn players who don't believe that effects of the same type do not stack. I have page 172 of the PHB quoted, but that doesn't seem to be enough. In particular, Someone with chain mail having Mage Armor cast on them -- their chain mail armor bonus doesn't stack with the Mage Armor, right? How can I make this absolutely clear? What book/Page number?

They're ready to revolt because they don't believe me that armor bonuses don't stack.

 

[Pax]

Any time two bonusses have the same "name" (i.e., "armor bonus"), they never stack, unless one of the sources makes a specific exception.

So, you are exactly correct: the Armor Bonus provided by a suit of chainmail does not stack with the Armor Bonus provided by a Mage Armor spell.

What you need to dois, take out your DMG and turn it to page 21, and read to them the passage entitled Bonus Types. It not only restates (muchmore briefly) that bonusses of the same type do not stack, it lists the exact types of bonusses found int eh Core Rules. and yes, "Armor Bonus" is among them, and is attributed not only to spells, but to nonmagical armor as well.

[Edit]
Further, the sidebar "Behind the Curtain: Stacking Bonusses", also on DMG p21, may be of use to you.
[/Edit]

 

[Rel]

I've got an idea: Bring them to the next North Carolina ENWorld Game Day and we'll tell them to their face that they're wrong.

Sorry, I saw that you were from NC and relatively new (based on your number of posts anyway) and wanted you to know about the upcoming Game Day. Hope you and your players can make it.

Otherwise, listen to Pax. He knows what he's talking about.

 

[dcollins]

Look on the page of the PHB where it lists armor. There's a section called "Armor Bonus" where it says exactly that about mage armor as an example.

 

[Lela]

Doesn't it say specifically in the Mage Armor spell that it doesn't stack with armor?

(I don't have my PHB right now, can't check).

 

[Camarath]

From Main FAQ

Does the magic armor bonus provided by the mage armor
spell or bracers of armor stack with nonmagic armor?
Would they stack with each other? Would they stack with
magic armor? Would it stack with a magic or nonmagic
shield? Why or why not? In the previous edition of the
game, the mage armor spell description specifically said the
spell didn’t stack with armor or other defensive spells. Why
doesn’t the current version of the spell so state?
Because it doesn’t have to. A mage armor spell provides an
armor bonus, as do bracers of armor. Two armor bonuses do
not stack, so a mage armor spell does not stack with bracers of
armor. Nor will a mage armor spell or bracers of armor stack
with a shield, which also provides an armor bonus. Note that
the armor bonus from a shield stacks with the armor bonus
from a suit of armor you wear, but that’s a special property of
shields and an exception to the stacking rule. Neither the mage
armor spell nor bracers of armor are suits of armor, so the
armor bonus from a shield does not stack with either of them.

 

[Lela]

Woah, I had understood that shields have their own type now (i.e. a Shield bonus to AC). Am I that far off on my rules? I gotta read the 3.5 books again. . .

 

[Diirk]

Thats probably from the 3.0 faq or something, shields provide a shield bonus to AC in 3.5 and thus stack with armour/mage armour etc.

 

[Camarath]

Thats probably from the 3.0 faq or something, shields provide a shield bonus to AC in 3.5 and thus stack with armour/mage armour etc.

It is I just posted it because it talks about mage armor not stacking with other thing which grant armor bonuses.

 

[Lela]

Good. Then I'm not nuts.