Hiding

[Vrecknidj]

I remember that, to use the Hide skill, you need to have concealment or cover (except, of course, in the case of certain class abilities). So, if someone drinks a potion of blur, then they can Hide, even right out in the open, right?

Dave

 

[mikebr99]

Nevermind...

Mike

 

[angry monkey]

sorry if this is a double post, can't see my original one and I got an error page...

the srd

You need cover or concealment in order to attempt a Hide check. Total cover or total concealment usually (but not always; see Special, below) obviates the need for a Hide check, since nothing can see you anyway.

So I'd say that yes, according to the RAW Blur does allow you to hide.

 

[Aaron2]

I remember that, to use the Hide skill, you need to have concealment or cover (except, of course, in the case of certain class abilities). So, if someone drinks a potion of blur, then they can Hide, even right out in the open, right?

You can hide but since your opponents know where you are it won't make a difference. The rules grant no special advantages to Hidden characters; they do not automatically get Sneak Attacks for example.


Aaron

 

[LokiDR]

Aaron, you must be mistaken. If you are hidden, oppents are flat footed against you. For most targets, this means they are denied their dexterity and can be sneak attacked.

I supposes, technically, you could cast blur, make a hide check, move up to your target over open ground (assuming your hide check > their spot check) and sneak attack. Although this seems silly, it does seem technically correct. This should also work with blink, though equally silly.

The question of power is more important, to me at least. A wizard 3 rogue 1 could blur, move accross open terain, and sneak attack. 1d6 extra damage for a wizard now in melee doesn't seem that powerful. More dangerous would be the high level rogue with a potion of blur and the enemy on an open field. Since this would require the rogue to know about the enemy ahead of time and use the potion in a situation where ranged sneak attack isn't viable, I don't see this as coming up too much.

 

[Aaron2]

Aaron, you must be mistaken. If you are hidden, oppents are flat footed against you. For most targets, this means they are denied their dexterity and can be sneak attacked.

Where does it say that? I've been looking for over a year now. It's definately not in the SRD.

In the glossery it says: "flat-footed: Expecially vulnerable to attacks at the beginning of a battle." Suprised and flat-footed are conditions that only occur at the beginning of a battle. The discussion of New Combatants in the DMG only makes mention of the new combatants possibly being flat-footed, not those currently in the battle.


Aaron

 

[Patryn of Elvenshae]

Where does it say that? I've been looking for over a year now. It's definately not in the SRD.

That's because it doesn't exist anywhere. The closest you'll be able to find is:

BLIND-FIGHT [GENERAL]

Benefit: In melee, every time you miss because of concealment, you can reroll your miss chance percentile roll one time to see if you actually hit.
An invisible attacker gets no advantages related to hitting you in melee. That is, you don’t lose your Dexterity bonus to Armor Class, and the attacker doesn’t get the usual +2 bonus for being invisible. The invisible attacker’s bonuses do still apply for ranged attacks, however.

You take only half the usual penalty to speed for being unable to see. Darkness and poor visibility in general reduces your speed to three-quarters normal, instead of one-half.

Normal: Regular attack roll modifiers for invisible attackers trying to hit you apply, and you lose your Dexterity bonus to AC. The speed reduction for darkness and poor visibility also applies.

Special: The Blind-Fight feat is of no use against a character who is the subject of a blink spell.

A fighter may select Blind-Fight as one of his fighter bonus feats.

In other words, you are denied your Dex bonus against invisible attackers, and they receive a +2 on attack rolls to hit you.

Note that this is *not* the same as flat-footed.

Note, also, that it applies to *invisible* creatures. There is some debate on whether or not someone who has suceeded on a Hide check should be considered invisble, and when they should lose that invisibility.

As to the question re: Blur. Yes, you could use Blur to make a Hide check. No, you couldn't use Blur to make a Hide check if someone is looking at you.

 

[LokiDR]

Thank you, Patryn of Elvenshae. No, you are not flat footed, you are attacking an unaware opponent. When you get out of sight and hide, you are not seen. The opponent may know where you went, or that you are in the area, but the fact that they do not know where gives you a distinct advantage. Distinctly +2 and no defender dex to AC (unless other abilities apply).

Hide can be used in the middle of combat. You can make a bluff to create a distraction to hide. Then you hide as part of your move action. Once hidden, you are virtually invisible to the opponent.

 

[Aaron2]

Note, also, that it applies to *invisible* creatures. There is some debate on whether or not someone who has suceeded on a Hide check should be considered invisble, and when they should lose that invisibility.

Treating hidden characters as invisible is an interpretation that is unsupportable by the RAW. Especially since invisible character are given a bonus to Hide checks. That makes no sense if Hidden=Invisible.

I might be getting carried away with this.

Aaron