History (and Background) for D&D

[mmadsen]

In a recent thread (Chivalry & Sorcery question), Kaptain_Kantrip asked "Which version or book of C&S had the cool info on medieval settings?" In addition to the answer to his question (the 3rd-edition Chivalry & Sorcery Gamemaster's Handbook), a few of us also recommended Pendragon (and its supplement Lordly Domains), Mythic Europe (for Ars Magica), and the Life in a Medieval... series of books by Joseph and Frances Geis.

Does anyone have an other suggestions for books on ancient or medieval society that gamers might enjoy?

Anyway, discussing real-life history brought some legitimate complaints. As hong pointed out, "D&D has never been about creating complex, believable societies, or emulating historical or even fantastical reality. World-building in D&D (and this is especially emphasised in 3E) is really about setting a stage where the actions of the characters can be played out."

Many of us do want complex, believable societies that emulate historical or fantastical reality though. In fact, I think many, many people want a game that feels like Tolkien's Middle Earth or Robert E. Howard's Hyboria, and setting the stage for our heroes' adventures means knowing at least the trappings of older societies.

While you don't want or need to know the economics of each menial job in the ancient world, setting the stage is much easier when you have some idea how a typical ancient or medieval society works. How does policing work in a medieval city? How does the military work? What happens to a group of adventurers who show up at the city gates? Who gets an audience with the king, how are they treated, how are they supposed to address the king?

If you want to set up some political intrigue, it's good to know who wields what power, and what they might be fighting over. How does money work? Are there bankers? How do they protect their money? What's a merchant caravan like?

I don't think I could've answered any of those questions as a kid playing D&D, but that info would've helped me set the stage for our heroes.

 

[Thorvald Kviksverd]

There are soooo many, where to begin?

Perhaps just one from each of three major periods...

Classical

The Peloponnesian War, Thucydides

Dark Ages

Edda (As well as the rest of the sagas)

Medieval

Medieval Warfare, Hans Delbrück (also, Warfare in Antiquity and The Barbarian Invasions)

 

[mmadsen]

There are soooo many, where to begin?

Well, which texts do you think are most readable (for gamers, not historians) and most applicable to gaming? Imagine you're recommending books to teenagers who like D&D but hate history class.

Classical -- The Peloponnesian War, Thucydides

For a very readable, fictionalized account of ancient Greek warfare, I highly recommend Gates of Fire, about the Spartan stand against the Persians at Thermopylae.

(I still need to read Thucydides.)

Dark Ages -- Edda (As well as the rest of the sagas)

Another work (or collection of works) I really need to read.

Medieval -- Medieval Warfare, Hans Delbrück (also, Warfare in Antiquity and The Barbarian Invasions)

And they're just $45 in paperback! I may have to swing by the library for those...

 

[Shadow of Bukrai]

Two words:

Hârn World.

Diggit:
www.swordsandshields.com/downloads
www.dndharnguide.addr.com
www.harnlink.com

 

[Lazybones]

For a literary view of the Middle Ages that's also fun to read, I recommend Boccacio's The Decameron. 100 tales written around the time of the Black Death--there's a lot of sex, violence, nuns with trousers on their heads, and insight into the mindset of medieval folks.

Chaucer's The Canterbury Tales is also worth the time (but get a modern translation).

For views of leadership that fit into the violence of these times, check out Einhard's Life of Charlemagne.

For an overview of medieval history that's surprisingly readable, I recommend Norman Cantor's Civilizaton in the Middle Ages. It gives a relatively brief overview to virtually everything that happened in this entire period of history, and includes social aspects as well as political.

I really enjoyed Gates of Fire as well, and recommend the Gies books that the first poster mentioned. I often used their book on medieval women when I was teaching western civ.

Finally, history buffs (or casually interested D&D players) can find tons of great history at the Internet Medieval Sourcebook at http://www.fordham.edu/halsall/sbook.html. Great stuff to browse (and steal for your campaign).

Lazybones

 

[Mark]

I'd recommend a couple of books...

The Creators by Daniel J Boorstin - Help me to build a "world perspective" into my campaigns and...

The Dictionary of Imaginary Places compiled by Alberto Manguel and Gianni Guadalupi - Helps me to jump start my imagination while setting up encounter.

While the former examines ideas and how they shape real world, the latter is a compilation of fantasy locations. Part of what made Tolkein and Howard come to life for me weren't how rooted the settings were in reality but rather how solidly the fantastical was explained through the emotional eyes of the characters. It felt as if these people existed and just so happen to exist in a world that wasn't real.

When I put together a setting location I try to approach it from the perspective of an individual's reactions (how they would feel and what would they think) to that environment.

I find that there are as many ways to tweak the rules and guidelines for creating a setting as there are alternative games to play (maybe more ). Ask one role-playing historian how their money system works in their D&D game, and they'll explain that it could only exist as... While another will tell you that to be true to a medieval system of government or society you can't use the same numbers in the DMG for creating your environment, you must actually use a system that... All of that, while important to explore, isn't at the top of my priority list for creating a setting that "feels" like Tolkein, Howard or, in essence, "real".

More important to me is to understand how an individual in my ficticious society would motivate themselves to achieve the things they desire. I'd strongly urge that anyone using any historical basis for developing a campaign examine all materials with an individual's perspective in the fore-front of their mind. Definitely do as much work as you can, or want, to lay down the systems by which society as a whole functions but focus on how a single person navigates those systems so that they can be presented during game play by the non-player characters that become the player character's conduit to that world.

A coin is only a concept until you actually need one in your pocket.

 

[Thorvald Kviksverd]

mmadsen-- I'll 3rd(?) your recommendation for Steven Pressfield's Gates of Fire.

His later novel, Tides of War, deals with the Peloponnesian War.

For some other semi-historical fiction...

The Camulod Chronicles, Jack Whyte (a more historical presentation of Arthur's Britain)

The Archers Tale, Bernard Cornwell (gives a good feel for the plight of the common footsoldier)

Deus lo Volt!, Evan S. Connell (a unique chronicle of the crusades)

I just recently picked-up two of Sharon Kay Penman's novels, Falls the Shadow and The Sunne in Splendour. I haven't read them yet, but they look promising.

 

[SHARK]

Greetings!

Well, for historical reading that can be interesting, I might also suggest the following books:

(1) Warfare In The Classical World; by John Warry.

(2) The Grand Strategy Of The Roman Empire, by Edward N. Luttwak

(3) Caesar's Legions, by Sekunda, Northwood, and Simkins.

(4) Quest For The Past, Published by Readers' Digest.

One covers a broad range of military topics in the ancient world, from the Bronze Age, through the fall of the Roman Empire. This is an excellent book, with many clear maps, diagrams, and color drawings of armor, weaponry, animals, equipment, and different soldiers in a wide range of armour, uniforms, and weaponry.

Two proceeds into an in depth discussion of the strategic operations and thinking in the Roman world, discussing the strategic problems facing Rome, as well as manpower, troop deployments, and all things military. This book also includes extensive century by century TOE's of Roman legions as time went by. The author explains the advantages of various Roman strategic policies, both militarily and diplomatically, as well as discussing their weaknesses. In addition, the book details possible alternative approaches that may have been superior at different points throughout Roman history. This is an excellent book for grand strategic thinking, assisting the reader in *how* the Roman Empire was defended militarily, with what resources, what were the challenges, and how these challenges were met. It also enlightens the reader as to what kinds of strategic dillema's and problems potentially face all large empires.

Three has many color drawings of Roman formations, uniforms, and equipment. Also discussed are Roman formations, training, organization, and tactics. A fine book to have.

Four is a large hardcover book that covers with rich text, as well as color drawings, maps, and diagrams, all sorts of different topics throughout the ancient and medieval world. Everything from ancient Egyptian brain-surgery to libraries, to Roman medicine, to Castles, Celtic Hill Forts, Monasteries, the Black Plague, medicine, religion, everything. It covers such a vast array of subjects, many familiar, and many are less well known, and even some that are obscure. It is a great treasure, and a book that I fine immense joy in reading and consulting frequently.

Semper Fidelis,

SHARK

 

[mmadsen]

(1) Warfare In The Classical World, by John Warry.

One covers a broad range of military topics in the ancient world, from the Bronze Age, through the fall of the Roman Empire. This is an excellent book, with many clear maps, diagrams, and color drawings of armor, weaponry, animals, equipment, and different soldiers in a wide range of armour, uniforms, and weaponry.

I'll second Warfare In The Classical World, if only for the evocative illustrations and diagrams. I didn't find the body text nearly as interesting though.

 

[mmadsen]

(4) Quest For The Past, Published by Readers' Digest.

Four is a large hardcover book that covers with rich text, as well as color drawings, maps, and diagrams, all sorts of different topics throughout the ancient and medieval world. Everything from ancient Egyptian brain-surgery to libraries, to Roman medicine, to Castles, Celtic Hill Forts, Monasteries, the Black Plague, medicine, religion, everything. It covers such a vast array of subjects, many familiar, and many are less well known, and even some that are obscure. It is a great treasure, and a book that I fine immense joy in reading and consulting frequently.

On the strength of your recommendation, SHARK, I just ordered a used copy of Quest For The Past. It better be good.