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Message: <blockquote data-quote="Ovinomancer" data-source="post: 6800539" data-attributes="member: 16814">I've said nothing of the kind.  You're skewering a strawman.In regards to the Roman Legions, this is actually largely true.  The Legions were very adaptable, but not at the individual level. They gleefully stole effective tactics from their enemies, and effective tools (the gladius, for instance, as the standard Legion sword, was adapted from one of their enemies).  But they real strength of the legions were their discipline and training and their superior equipment, which was largely standardized within the Legions.Totally agree, has never happened.  The antebellum South peaked at about 50%.  I didn't say they didn't.  I said that the military formations they used were the Legion -the elite heavy infantry drawn exclusively from the citizenry - and the auxilia or auxiliaries - the non-citizen corps the supported the legions.  Yes, the auxilia outnumbered the Legions, nothing I said indicates otherwise.  Roman citizens did sometimes join the auxilia, but given that pay was drastically lower than for the legions, the number and reasons for doing so were varied.  Typically, a citizen in the auxilia held a higher rank than they would in the legions (offsetting the pay) or were the citizen sons of those that had previously served and won citizenship in doing so (citizenship after duty was often a reward for serving in the auxilia).  But the standard rule was the the auxilia were recruited from the non-citizen members of the Republic/Empire.  You know, it's funny you say that, as you've failed, so far, to show my misunderstanding.  You've stood up a bunch of strawmen and shown they have no clue, so, um, bravo for that, but I'm sitting here quite humored that your brief wiki reading (and a poor one at that) constitutes actual rebuttal for the things I've said.  Especially since the wiki pretty much agrees with me.I'm not postulating a clone army.  My hobs in my games are terrifying even for mid-leveled characters because they are ruthless, smart, cunning, adaptable, and disciplined.  Much like the Legions were in Rome.  They also have heavy leavenings of goblin archers/skirmishers, bugbear brute squads,  warg calvary, troll specialty teams, etc.  They make allies, and use those allies to great effect.  Goblins are sneaky and good for scouting and sniping where hobgoblins aren't.  Bugbears are strong and powerful but not disciplined, so they use them as shocktroops to soften lines for assault.  Trolls are rare, but powerful, and largely uncontrollable, so they use them carefully to cause maximum destruction and carnage while they conduct operations elsewhere.  Wargs make excellent light calvary as they're almost as smart as goblins but can be trained to have more discipline.  But hobgoblins excel at unit tactics and unshakable discipline, and are some of the hardest lines to crack on the battlefield.My hobs are anything but cookie cutter.  Dude.  Seriously.  Read and understand.  I've clearly said that a hobgoblin tribe/nation could only front 15% of it's total population, including slaves, into the field at one time without risking famine.  Which part of that implies that there aren't hobgoblins doing those things, or managing slaves to do the same?  Yes, I've said that the highest calling is war, and all hobgoblins are trained in those arts as a part of their culture, but past that I've even clearly said that hobgoblins are doing some of the labor, and likely most of the crafts, with the labor part being embarrassing (who wants to be a farmer when going to glorious war is the height of hobgoblinhood?  Some do it, but it doesn't mean their proud of their work).  There are write-ups of hobgoblins that say they have a caste structure, with warrior on top and workers on the bottom.  My analysis, while it doesn't require such a caste system, works with it, just as it supports all of the needed things you say about.15%.  That's the number I fronted.  I started with the historical 7%, and upped it because the hobs have such a militaristic bent and seem apt to practice total war.  What was implicit in that is that the remaining hobs will be maintaining the homelands.Once again, you've vented a great deal of spleen over something you've misunderstood and could have resolved much easier with a question.Goblins.  Ogres and trolls and bugbears aren't well suited to scouting.  Well, bugbears are good at sneaking, but it's not quite the same thing.  But what you're saying is that a predominately human civilization would be stupid to let halflings help scout their lands because they aren't human.  You chew on that while I get back to hobgoblins having a rep for using other goblinoid races.I've never spoken about individuals.  I've been on the macro scale the whole time.  To whit, one of my all time favorite characters was a hobgoblin fighter/rogue.  Individuals can do individual things -- I'm discussing groups as a whole.  The vast majority of hobgoblins do not have class levels in anything.And that's the first reasonable, non-attacking, thing you've said.  I'd have zero problem with someone coming up with a different organization for hobs, including a differing fighting style, so long as it maintained their warlike focus and rep for discipline.  However, I was under the impression we were talking about the MM hobgoblins.</blockquote>

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