Holding a charge and spell conditions

[Empirate]

I see. Well, you're out of luck then.

But how about 'morphing into a Hydra instead of a Treant? No huge strength, no huge NA, but a whole crapload of attacks. Anything you go for will die really, really fast. And you can attack with all your heads as a standard action. Just pick as many heads as you can fit HD into your caster level, and you're good!

 

[Faskill]

I haven't met any Hydra so he won't let me morph into one >_<

 

[Greenfield]

Okay, let's try to think inside the box.

Everything we've been suggesting is apparently counter to the way the DM wants to run this game, outside his "box". Let's think about why he's made that box, and how you can fit inside it..

Do you think the DM sees you or your PC as a "problem child" type, who has to be reined in? Is your character the one who kills everything, who can't be stopped? Does your DM perhaps see him that way?

Consider this option: Invite your DM to join the Enworld forums. We'll hear his side of things (and I guarantee that he has one), and he'll be exposed to some other views on how to run a game.

I suspect that if the two of you discuss what he's expecting from the game, as well as what you seem to think it's lacking, you'll come to a better understanding.

If you decide to talk in person, try this for an opening line: "What am I doing wrong?" Ask it, and mean it. He may actually have an answer.

 

[Faskill]

I think he sees my character that way, yes, because of the awesome effects of polymorph (29 Str, +2 size, immunities... but vulnerability fire)

The problem is that I can't not use Polymorph because I have no equipment to speak off that would allow me to fight in normal form...

So it is kind of an infernal spiral, and my GM won't hear me when I try talking to him. Like I said before, he just goes back to explaining me how the rules are what they are and how it's not his problem.
He says that my character is powerful when he's polymorphed so I shouldn't be given any items, regardless of their being only useful in regular form.

Now he counters polymorph by using a lot of dispells and fire spells so it is getting really annoying but I don't really know what to do...
I would like to be able to fight in regular form but my everytime I try to do so I almost die because my character is so weak and does no damage...

Also, he won't be able to explain himself on this forum because he doesn't speak any English (I'm French), you don't know how troublesome it is to translate him everything ^^

 

[Greenfield]

Okay, go limp on him.

Find some other forms to Polymorph to, things with different advantages and weaknesses. Things that don't scare him so much.

Alternately, retire the character and come up with something new, something that has an operating mode somewhere between helpless and awesome. Something that can use the items he's willing to allow.

You see, like most other DMs I know, I've had players come in with one-trick characters, characters who have invested everything into one and only one maneuver or battle tactic. When they get to use it they're nearly unstoppable. When they can't they're pretty much out of the action.

The players typically complain if it looks like I'm intentionally blocking their favorite tactic (as they should), but every time they get an opportunity to expand their repertoire they just invest more in their one favorite tactic. They have no combat mode between "limp noodle" and "godly might".

And while they enjoy having a character with a reputation as a mighty warrior, they hate it when enemies who have heard that reputation bother to take precautions.

I had a player in a Convention game one time who claimed that his character had a shape-shift ability, similar to the Shape Change spell. He also said it was a racial feature and didn't have any ECL adjustment. (It later turned out he was running a Changeling, whose ability in no way resembles Shape Change.)

The game was supposed to be around 12th level, and he had 12 Rogue levels. Needless to say he was grossly overpowered. But since it was a pick-up game at a convention I blew it off and told him to go with it.

Part way through the adventure he had turned into a White Dragon to transport the party on a vital mission. He saw part of an invading army camped below and decided to have some fun. He landed and demanded tribute from them.

Their leader was a war chief, 12 hd fighter type, and his second was an 11th level Sorcerer. Facing a Dragon that they weren't prepared for, along with a heavily armed party, they figured they were dead. The Sorcerer, in desperation, threw a Scorching Ray spell. four dice, three times.

It was his only fire spell, and fire spells were the obvious choice.

The sorcerer hit with all three bolts, and critted on one of them. The player never forgave me for killing his "awesome creation". The damage amounted to 20 D6 of fire, no Save, with add on damage because of fire vulnerability, to a creature that had 12 D6 + con for hit points.

The player accused me of creating the scenario just to kill his PC. The fact is, he went looking for trouble and intentionally diverted from their diplomatic mission to pick this fight. And while the bulk of the troops would be cannon fodder for the PCs, having the leadership at or near their levels didn't seem out of line at all.

To him it looked like I was picking on him. To others it might have looked like I was swatting a cheater. To me? It was just an encounter at or near their level, and an NPC making an obvious spell choice in a desperate situation.

I honestly thought he had some sort of fire resistance.

The point of me telling this tale is that to the DM it may look like you're power gaming, and the last thing a DM does with a power gaming player is hand them more power.

So you need to break that image. Tone your PC down a bit in combat. Ask your Dm about some alternate Polymorph forms that won't overkill his scenarios. Let him know that you're trying to work with him for game balance and so everyone can have fun.

Alternate forms with 7 HD or so: Annis Hag, Large with Improved Grab, Strength of 25 and +10 Natural armor.


Harpy - Medium Monstrous humanoid with claws and wings, decent combat but great mobility.

Lammasu - Large magical beast, +10 Natural AC, 23 Str, average flight, another 7 Hd monster.

Remorhaz might cross him up a bit. Burrowing speed this time. Huge magical beast with Swallow Whole. 26 Strength, and +11 Natural Armor).

If you can go to 8 hd monsters, look at the Polar Bear. Decent natural armor (+5), good claw attacks, and a 27 Strength. With his Large size and Improved Grab, his Grapple is at +18 which ain't too shabby.

Do a search of the SRD specifically for hit dice of a particular size. The options might surprise you.

 

[RUMBLETiGER]

Truth is, Polymorph really is a strong spell.

What if, as an alternative option, you tried to compromise with your DM like this, saying something to the effect, "I promise to retrain my character to lose the Polymorph spell forever if I can just get..." and fill in the blank with some sort of reasonable alternative.

 

[Faskill]

Well actually it is only useful for me to morph into creatures that are able to cast spells so I don't think your creatures qualify except for the Lammasu. I already kinda tried this technique by using Troll and Hill Giant forms but it doesn't seem to matter for my GM... He just kept on using dispell magic on me in every single fight, sometimes I resist, more often I don't and have to remorph:s

To Rumbletieger : I don't think I'd be able to give up polymorph for anything but a monk belt, ogre giant gloves and/or Fanged ring, all of which he absolutely refuses to give me.

Maybe it won't do anything to make things more peaceful but your post made me realize that it wasn't actually completely "cheating" for my GM to use dispell/fire users if I made a name for myself polymorphing into a treant. I will level up 12 in the next adventure and I'm really thinking about picking the mageslayer feat that would reduce my damage (effictively cancelling my practiced spellcaster feat) all the while preventing the enemies' mage to have at least 2 rounds of free spell casting before I smash his head (by trampling his ass at the beginning of the fight).

Does it sound like a good idea?

 

[RUMBLETiGER]

Mage Slayer Feat.

Note the line, "Taking this feat reduces your caster level for all spells and spell-like abilities by 4."

Therefore, this is not a good idea. You're effectively a 9th level Sorcerer in your build in the OP (which, by the way, is already written as a 12th level character, so I'm a little confused, but I'm assuming you just put it up there because you're really close to hitting level 12). Reducing your caster level by 4 will make you effectively a 5th level Sorcerer, you'd only cast up to 2nd level spells, no more Polymorph for you for a long time. The Mage Slayer feat is for non-casters.

Are you asking for ideas on what sorts of things you might be able to do to be more effective and survive and thrive? Because I'm sure some of the fine people here could offer you useful ideas.

Would you be willing to give up Polymorph for another spell? I'm figuring you want spells that increase your combat effectiveness while still allowing you to cast spells. Some suggestions include:
-Bite of the Warewolf (SpC p.29)
-Greater Invisibility (PHB p.245)
-Sandform (Sandstorm p.119)

Another alternative would be to start casting Polymorph on your allies instead of yourself. Turns out when you start playing more of a party support-seeming role, in general a specific player tends to get less negative attention from a DM.

 

[Empirate]

Mage Slayer Feat.

Note the line, "Taking this feat reduces your caster level for all spells and spell-like abilities by 4."

Therefore, this is not a good idea. You're effectively a 9th level Sorcerer in your build in the OP (which, by the way, is already written as a 12th level character, so I'm a little confused, but I'm assuming you just put it up there because you're really close to hitting level 12). Reducing your caster level by 4 will make you effectively a 5th level Sorcerer, you'd only cast up to 2nd level spells, no more Polymorph for you for a long time. The Mage Slayer feat is for non-casters.

Are you asking for ideas on what sorts of things you might be able to do to be more effective and survive and thrive? Because I'm sure some of the fine people here could offer you useful ideas.

Would you be willing to give up Polymorph for another spell? I'm figuring you want spells that increase your combat effectiveness while still allowing you to cast spells. Some suggestions include:
-Bite of the Warewolf (SpC p.29)
-Greater Invisibility (PHB p.245)
-Sandform (Sandstorm p.119)

Another alternative would be to start casting Polymorph on your allies instead of yourself. Turns out when you start playing more of a party support-seeming role, in general a specific player tends to get less negative attention from a DM.

Slight nitpick: While Mage-Slayer is indeed a terrible, terrible idea for the OP, the caster level reduction wouldn't disallow his higher-level casting. It would just put his effective caster level for all spells at 5, reducing damage, duration, and most importantly, forms available for Polymorph (can't 'morph into something with more HD than your CL).

Haggling with the DM doesn't seem to be an option, if I follow the OP's argument. Like, at all. Also, while Polymorph is a broken, broken spell, as we all know quite well, Bite of the Were-X is not so far behind. The sheer numbers given in the spell description will probably put off the OP's DM.

Greater Invisibility is a valid option next level, but doesn't do much to increase damage output. I'd consider it, if it were me, but for pure combat effectiveness, Greater Invisibility is only of interest to sneak attackers IMO.

Sandform is really more of a utility spell than a combat buff, isn't it? Where it buffs, it's more of a defensive thing anyway. So again, no real advantage for damage output.

Moreover, choosing something else over Polymorph doesn't change the fact that caster enemies will just try to dispel him all the time anyway.


To me it seems the OP's character is intended as a melee machine. Going around to buff others makes him effectively the sucker for the simple reason that he has taken levels in Monk and Enlightened Fist instead of Incantatrix and War Weaver. Leave buffing to more dedicated buffers. Putting Polymorph on somebody else will also likely be less effective a use of the spell than 'morphing himself. Finally, dispelling somebody else isn't really any harder than dispelling the OP's character. I'd say his modus operandi so far is sound from a theoretical standpoint.



I cannot see an easy in-game solution, and out-of-game talks haven't worked so far and seem to hold little promise, should you try again, OP. Therefore, the last bit of advice I can give you is the following:

Think from a different angle: You've already "won". Most fights revolve around your character to a large degree: You're able to stomp the opposition unless they spend considerable resources on getting rid of your buffs. Non-caster enemies have no good answer for your polymorphing scheme, and caster enemies waste their actions countering your buffs (which you can re-cast) instead of laying waste to your party with save-or-die and battlefield control.
In most fights, you can either lay the hurt down - or you're at least doing an excellent job of tanking the opposition's spell output. It's a bit like a counterspell in advance, with the option of trashing the enemy if he doesn't try to dispel first chance he gets! Should you ever acquire a Ring of Counterspells (or take the Reactive Counterspell feat yourself), the first Dispelling attempt will even be blocked. And fire resistance really shouldn't be hard to come by in some form.

Far as I'm concerned, you're good, you're sitting high and dry, you're being effective. Sure, you could be even more effective with more specialized tools (items, polymorph forms). But by no means is your character being picked upon in a way that renders him impotent!

 

[Faskill]

Just to clarify things, our gaming group is usually playing once a week and I posted my message just after our last session (which as you can imagine, was really annoying for me). The DM has told us that we would level up 12 at the next game which is why I posted that my character was already level 12, without actually having picked my 12th level feat.

The thing is that I'm currently using the Practiced Spellcaster feat that gives me +4 caster level so the Mage Slayer feat would only cancel that out, still allowing me to cast spells as a level 9 caster. What's more, the treant's form 15' reach would allow me to annoy a lot of casters wouldn't it?
The idea came not from a "power gaming" perspective but to make my char less powerful (effectively decreasing it's raw damage) all the while countering the opponents attempts at dispelling me (which is a bit the same than picking sub obtimal forms IMHO).

But now that I've had some time to think about it, it seems that you're right Empirate, the attempts to counter my char make him de facto useful, even if I'm not as efficient in combat as I could be.