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Message: <blockquote data-quote="Willie the Duck" data-source="post: 9585469" data-attributes="member: 6799660">A discussion about the 1E/2E 'balanced across time' paradigm with regards to the balanced-party paradigm should probably mention that the 1E/2E thief was a quasi-mandated* role, starts out low-power, and ends up low-power (despite a favorable xp chart).*not as much as a cleric, bashing in doors and throwing HP against traps is a viable strategy.Speaking more generally, I am in favor of playstyles where a group gets to choose their role loadout, and then selectively curate the adventures they attempt based on their capabilities/what they want to do. If everyone wants to play a wizard or no one wants to play a cleric, choose adventures where that is non-suicidal. The game system has to play ball on this, as does the GM. Regarding the former, modern D&D has opened up some things (HP recovery, tracking, trap-finding), but other things (higher-level status removal like the greater Restoration-like spells) are still locked behind a few class options. The GM can address this by making sure potions/scrolls are available. To the later, a GM can set up a sandbox campaign, but if any direction you look there are challenges only a balanced party can reasonably accomplish, it leaves the locked role-requirements intact. This can be addressed simply by not doing so.Trying not to stick with D&D-like examples, there's a wide variety in how much this issue arises. Few games have the level of mandatory role as various D&Ds with healer or even trapfinder classes, although that can depend on player's choosing activities like above (if you have no netrunner in Shadowrun/Cyberpunk, you choose jobs where it isn't a necessity). More often, it's closer to fighters vs wizards in D&D, where some tasks are simply harder (lack of tank, no area-effect against minion swarms, etc.). Traveller where no one has a military background or Star Wars where no one plays a force user can run into this (depending on iteration of the rules). Honestly, open-/build-a-bear games like Hero System can run into this kind of situation ('no one made a flier?' 'no one can breath underwater?') as or more easily than many of the defined-role games.</blockquote>

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