How about a deadline to WotC?

[dmccoy1693]

It seems to me that the 3PP have more to lose than WotC by walking away from the table, so to speak. And I imagine WotC knows this. As such an ultimatum would be completely counter-productive.

This.

 

[Cadfan]

Its a silly threat that no one with an understanding of business will sign.

The basic problem is that a 3rd party publisher can easily produce books for both Pathfinder and for 4e, and make money on both. Even if a 3rd party publisher was dumb enough to burn bridges that might lead to future employment or contract work and sign some sort of aggressive ultimatum, and even if as a result of that ultimatum they publish something under Pathfinder, once the GSL is done they will be faced with a problem- do they maintain their refusal to publish 4e material even though, with the GSL completed, that's essentially leaving money on the table?

Of course they won't. Not if they're business people. And if they're business people they'll know that's going to happen in advance, and won't sign. And if they're business people and they DO sign, if WOTC knows they're business people, WOTC will know that the threat is empty and that they'll go back on their word once there's money to be had.

The only way the threat could be even slightly credible is if there were something to bind the 3rd party publishers to their word. Maybe if their only product was a single Adventure Path or something. That's about all I can come up with.

 

[SteveC]

A threat to WotC won't mean anything because they simply don't care. What will matter (to me at least) is if you can get a third party company to file the fingerprints off of 4E and make an OGL version of it. I'd love that and would happily pick it up in a minute.

An OGL "4Eesque" game would allow third party companies to continue existing product lines as if nothing had happened, and I'm surprised no one has gotten this to print yet.

--Steve

 

[Umbran]

And what is statistical data but just a collection of anecdotes?

It is a collection of structured and focused anecdotes from a random selection, rather than a collection of biased anecdotes from a self-selected population.

Where and how you get your data is important, you know.

 

[Jack99]

So you prefer 3e over 4e, and 3e over Pathfinder. Would you rather have Pathfinder over 4e as well? If so, maybe you should convince the companies whose products you want, to produce Pathfinder products, instead of this, since whatever it is, it is doomed to fail, for the many reasons outlined by the illustrious members of this community.

 

[dmccoy1693]

Just remember, WotC could end the GSL at any point they desire. There almost wasn't any sort of license.

 

[Henry]

My understanding is the opposite. From Scott Rouse's last posts, it sounds like he's the only one who cares about it, and for the GSL to get updated he has to do the whole thing himself in his spare time at work (which he hasn't had).

To underscore this, one of the two people fighting hardest for it, Linae Foster, Licensing Manager, was fired from the company -- two weeks after a new GSL was approved.

So Scott, and at best a handful of internal designers, are the extent of the "we care about third party" bandwagon.

 

[The Little Raven]

An OGL "4Eesque" game would allow third party companies to continue existing product lines as if nothing had happened, and I'm surprised no one has gotten this to print yet.

I'm not surprised. The successful third-party companies like GR and Paizo are professionals who wouldn't just "file off the fingerprints" of someone else's work to make a buck in order to avoid the official license.

 

[JVisgaitis]

My understanding is the opposite. From Scott Rouse's last posts, it sounds like he's the only one who cares about it, and for the GSL to get updated he has to do the whole thing himself in his spare time at work (which he hasn't had).

I actually meant Scott instead of they.

 

[Henry]

I'm not surprised. The successful third-party companies like GR and Paizo are professionals who wouldn't just "file off the fingerprints" of someone else's work to make a buck in order to avoid the official license.

On the other hand, my concern for Paizo in Pathfinder is that they are avoiding using good ideas from WotC due to both backwards compatibility and fear that they're accidentally duplicate something from 4E. As I noted about nine months ago, most of 4E's most important innovations are OGL content to begin with, and they're getting overlooked because of a mix of company loyalty and 4E-rage. Those self same ideas over in Star Wars Saga Edition (such as the math restructuring, defenses, skills, etc.) are getting rave reviews and applause.