D&D 5E How good is flames of Phlefethos for a Fighter-Rogue?

ECMO3

Hero
Thinking about this feat but I have never seen it played. Looking for some opinions.

I have a Glaysa Tiefling Arcane Trickster 4/Fighter1. The only fire spell she has or will likely get is Green Flame Blade, which is her normal melee attack. She uses a bow more though to be honest and will probably be an Arcane Archer when she gets a fighter subclass.

I am thinking of taking this feat instead of an ASI at fighter 4. Rerolling 1 on the fire damage would be nice, but it is really the "sheathe in flames" I like the most. I currently have a 16 intelligence, I would use this to get 1 more and then probably take another half feat in intelligence at fighter 6.
 

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Mort

Legend
Supporter
flavor wise - it's fine the whole light up and cause damage to enemies thing is kind of neat.

But the feat seems pretty underpowered for you:

1) you don't actually get any benefit from the ASI increase until much later (3-5 levels is a potentially LONG time). So it's lost.

2) while you DO get the benefit of being 5th level for rerolling 1s on green flame blade damage, it's not a lot at all because it's only the fire damage. It's like an average of 1 damage per attack.

What's your DEX? If it's even you're likely better giving it a +2 and getting +1 on damage, AC AND DEX saves. If it's odd splitting dex and int or getting a Dex half feat is good. Or heck sharpshooter and take advantage of steady aim!
 

ECMO3

Hero
flavor wise - it's fine the whole light up and cause damage to enemies thing is kind of neat.

But the feat seems pretty underpowered for you:

1) you don't actually get any benefit from the ASI increase until much later (3-5 levels is a potentially LONG time). So it's lost.

2) while you DO get the benefit of being 5th level for rerolling 1s on green flame blade damage, it's not a lot at all because it's only the fire damage. It's like an average of 1 damage per attack.

What's your DEX? If it's even you're likely better giving it a +2 and getting +1 on damage, AC AND DEX saves. If it's odd splitting dex and int or getting a Dex half feat is good. Or heck sharpshooter and take advantage of steady aim!
Thanks .... I think my quandry is I really like the flavor for this [articular character but it is underpowered compared to other less flavorful options.

My Dex is 16 currently.
 

Thinking about this feat but I have never seen it played. Looking for some opinions.

I have a Glaysa Tiefling Arcane Trickster 4/Fighter1. The only fire spell she has or will likely get is Green Flame Blade, which is her normal melee attack. She uses a bow more though to be honest and will probably be an Arcane Archer when she gets a fighter subclass.

I am thinking of taking this feat instead of an ASI at fighter 4. Rerolling 1 on the fire damage would be nice, but it is really the "sheathe in flames" I like the most. I currently have a 16 intelligence, I would use this to get 1 more and then probably take another half feat in intelligence at fighter 6.

Unless I’m missing something, you would also get use from it with the Tieflings’s Hellish Rebuke ability. Which is pretty cool flavour wise, getting hit only to light up with fire, and stay lit up.
 

Mort

Legend
Supporter
Thanks .... I think my quandry is I really like the flavor for this [articular character but it is underpowered compared to other less flavorful options.

My Dex is 16 currently.

Another thought, you could take arcane initiate instead. Grab some extra fire cantrips (firebolt, create bonfire) and a nice first level spell like find familiar. Not QUITE as flavorful but you can fix that by having the familiar be appropriately Glasyaesque.
 
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I second the Idea for Arcane Initiate, though I suggest Firebolt and Control Flame. No need to take two attack cantrips when you can reliably use weapons, and frankly the idea of controlling fire cosmetically sounds WAY more on brand than summoning bonfires.

Alternatively you could even just cross class sorcerer or fiend warlock. Sure it may not be optimal but would grant you a lot of potential flavor. Even a single level grants you a bunch of cantrips and access to fire magic.
 


ECMO3

Hero
I second the Idea for Arcane Initiate, though I suggest Firebolt and Control Flame. No need to take two attack cantrips when you can reliably use weapons, and frankly the idea of controlling fire cosmetically sounds WAY more on brand than summoning bonfires.

Alternatively you could even just cross class sorcerer or fiend warlock. Sure it may not be optimal but would grant you a lot of potential flavor. Even a single level grants you a bunch of cantrips and access to fire magic.
She has a familiar but no longer has the find familiar spell. She summoned the familiar at Rogue-3 then got rid of the FF spell at Rogue 4. Conceptually, I do like the idea of a Magic Initiate Feat, but I don't think that holds up any better.

Fey or Fiend Warlock could be very thematic for the Character, her backstory is she is grew up in the Feywild and was a prisoner of the the Queen of Air And Darknes who she escaped from. The queen, or one of her minions, could track her down ... or alternatively her Cambion mother who she never met could come looking for her. Either could force a pact on her. She has a 14 wisdom. That is a 3rd class to add though and while I love multiclassing, triple classing often gets messy.

Thanks for the ideas though, I will take a look at it.
 

Stalker0

Legend
Just to provide the raw numbers here so we know exactly what we are doing with.

So greenflame does 1d8 fire on main and a 1d8 fire on a secondary. Lets assume we get the full benefit on every attack.

The feat increases a d8 from 4.5 -> 4.9375, so +.875 damage at absolute best. This means +.5 expected damage is probably more reasonable, as in many cases there won't be another target within 5 feet.

Now lets compare that to a +2 to intelligence. That's a +2 boost at absolute best to damage, probably closer to 1.1 when we think of single targets.

Mechanically, using the spell just to augment your attack every round is simpler inferior to the stat. HOWEVER, we have the X factor, the surrounding flames.

Every attack that hits you effectively "deals" 2.5 fire damage. So if you are getting hit once every 4 rounds lets say...you could make the case that the feat is actually getting you more damage than the +2 to a caster stat.


Obviously, there are other factors, how often you cast other fire spells, etc etc. But if we combine both benefits of the feat I think its pretty close to balance with a stat boost, certainly close enough that I would not deny yourself a cool flavor to push for mechanical perfection.


So TLDR: Take the feat, you'll be fine:)
 

Thanks .... I think my quandry is I really like the flavor for this [articular character but it is underpowered compared to other less flavorful options.

My Dex is 16 currently.

You know how sometimes in high school they have a former drug addict give these talks about how you should stay away from drugs?

Take it from an inveterate optimizer: go for the flavor, not the numbers.
 

ECMO3

Hero
Every attack that hits you effectively "deals" 2.5 fire damage. So if you are getting hit once every 4 rounds lets say...you could make the case that the feat is actually getting you more damage than the +2 to a caster stat.
She has a 10 constitution, cunning escape and the shield spell ..... so once every 4 rounds is probably (and hopefully) more than she is getting hit.
 


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