D&D 5E How good is PC burrow speed?

[NaturalZero]

I'm working on my homebrew totemist class and I'm looking at just how many monsters of the monstrosity type (formerly "magical beast" in 3.x) get burrow speed and it seems, thematically, like totemists should be able to gain access from at least one of their melds. When i stopped to think about it though, i realized how potentially game breaking burrow speed is on a PC, compared to a monster. If you pick up a class or ability that lets you Disengage as a bonus action, you can basically pop up, attack, and then hide underground on everyone else's turn.

Are there any spells or abilities that exist in 5e that I'm forgetting, for sake of comparison? Does anyone have any real experience with burrowing PCs being problematic?

 

[Nevvur]

Some food for thought: the burrowing creatures I can think of off the top of my head all have tremorsense (bullette, purple worm, earth elemental, etc). Kind of important to know what's happening on the surface for them to use their burrowing ability in a tactically optimal manner. Unless the PC class has some manner of navigating, he should be considered blind. This can be tough to enforce impartially on a grid and almost meaningless in TotM.

The only real experience I've had with burrowing PCs is a moon druid turning into an earth elemental, but he hasn't exploited it in a way I would consider problematic. It's not even his go-to wildshape, and when he does use it, burrowing isn't his go-to tactic. Not because burrowing isn't OP as hell, but because he fancies himself a tank and wants to be hit. Or targeted, rather.

But to be clear, I do think burrowing is OP as hell, and I wouldn't make it a class feature. It's comparable to the Fly and Blink spells in the sense you become untargetable to many opponents, but without any of the downsides. As a homebrew spell, I would probably make it a short duration (1 min) 3rd level spell, or 10 min 4th level spell. Just throwin' some numbers out there. Alternately, if you have a strong desire to make burrowing a class feature, I would hold off til level 10ish.

 

[Jefe Bergenstein]

I'm working on my homebrew totemist class and I'm looking at just how many monsters of the monstrosity type (formerly "magical beast" in 3.x) get burrow speed and it seems, thematically, like totemists should be able to gain access from at least one of their melds. When i stopped to think about it though, i realized how potentially game breaking burrow speed is on a PC, compared to a monster. If you pick up a class or ability that lets you Disengage as a bonus action, you can basically pop up, attack, and then hide underground on everyone else's turn.

Are there any spells or abilities that exist in 5e that I'm forgetting, for sake of comparison? Does anyone have any real experience with burrowing PCs being problematic?

I don't think you'd even need to disengage, since the opportunity attack would only occur when you left the threatened radius. The ground provides total cover. So you'd meld with the dirt, the enemy would attack, and then hit dirt. It's why incorporeal creatures can just hit and run so easily.

 

[NaturalZero]

Some food for thought: the burrowing creatures I can think of off the top of my head all have tremorsense (bullette, purple worm, earth elemental, etc). Kind of important to know what's happening on the surface for them to use their burrowing ability in a tactically optimal manner. Unless the PC class has some manner of navigating, he should be considered blind. This can be tough to enforce impartially on a grid and almost meaningless in TotM.

For the totemist, every soulmeld is going to have a passive base feature. Tremorsense seems like a strong, but fair, passive trait while the burrow speed is pretty strong,

But to be clear, I do think burrowing is OP as hell, and I wouldn't make it a class feature. It's comparable to the Fly and Blink spells in the sense you become untargetable to many opponents, but without any of the downsides. As a homebrew spell, I would probably make it a short duration (1 min) 3rd level spell, or 10 min 4th level spell. Just throwin' some numbers out there. Alternately, if you have a strong desire to make burrowing a class feature, I would hold off til level 10ish.

The more i think about it, the more i think it's more OP than flying. When flying, you're still vulnerable to ranged attacks and spells but you'e completely immune when you're underground. hmm...

I don't think you'd even need to disengage, since the opportunity attack would only occur when you left the threatened radius. The ground provides total cover. So you'd meld with the dirt, the enemy would attack, and then hit dirt. It's why incorporeal creatures can just hit and run so easily.

Opportunity Attacks actually go off before the triggering event, so you can hit them before they move out of range. If this weren't the case, you'd never get OAs with weapons without reach because you'd never be able hit anyone after they've moved out of your 5' bubble.

 

[MarkB]

A couple of notes:

Druids' wildshape forms have restrictions against flying or swimming abilities, but not against burrowing, so characters with this capability are already possible in the base game.

The Monster Manual specifies that creatures can burrow through sand, earth, mud or ice. Burrowing through stone is only possible if specified in the creature's description. So this capability will be situational enough that a character built around it will find his tactic foiled a fair percentage of the time.

 

[Jefe Bergenstein]

Opportunity Attacks actually go off before the triggering event, so you can hit them before they move out of range. If this weren't the case, you'd never get OAs with weapons without reach because you'd never be able hit anyone after they've moved out of your 5' bubble.

The burrower sinking 5 feet straight down is still in the 5' threat range. When they leave the threat radius they have 100% cover from the dirt though. It's only if they go diagnally and away that they would provoke an attack. This is safer, it just costs 5' of movement.

It's why you can't attack someone around a corner with an AOO.

 

[NaturalZero]

A couple of notes:

Druids' wildshape forms have restrictions against flying or swimming abilities, but not against burrowing, so characters with this capability are already possible in the base game.

The Monster Manual specifies that creatures can burrow through sand, earth, mud or ice. Burrowing through stone is only possible if specified in the creature's description. So this capability will be situational enough that a character built around it will find his tactic foiled a fair percentage of the time.

Hmm. I had considered driud and i think my issue is going to be giving a straight-up, melee-spec class/build access to burrowing as opposed to some of the (relatively) less potent wildshape forms. If anything, I'll stick around the same level as fly. Actually, it might something to give my totemist a unique combat feel. Less raw damage than a fighter or pally, but a utility or gimmick like bursting from the ground.

The burrower sinking 5 feet straight down is still in the 5' threat range. When they leave the threat radius they have 100% cover from the dirt though. It's only if they go diagnally and away that they would provoke an attack. This is safer, it just costs 5' of movement.

It's why you can't attack someone around a corner with an AOO.

Oh, right. i'm trying to get back into 5e and forgot that provoking is different from 3.5 and 4e.