D&D 5E (2024) How I would do 6E.

[GrimCo]

Well that's the crux of it.

6e would have to be willing to fully support another subsystem than spells. And this is an age thing where you need designers willing to do that and executives willing to provide resources

We already had cool system for martials back in 3.5. Bo9S with stances and manouvers. It's similar to spells with 9 levels, manouvers known and prepared. But there are no slots. There are unique recovery methods for in fight recovery, but in essence, every readied manouver is per encounter ability. 5e battlemaster is very very poor, sad and inferior version of that idea.

People hate Bo9S because it went into wuxia teritory, it was too much "anime" like. But that was 20 years ago. Since then, anime is way more mainstream. P

 

[Minigiant]

Yeah I dont see them taking any risks at the moment. So no innovation most likely....

I dont think having designers who want to do this is a problem, the executive part is though.

I don't see them taking huge risks at the moment because many of the heads are now new, and they're saddled with a system where the previous heads make the game extremely spell based..

Now I don't think that the executives would stop the designers. If they decided to make a martial, magic item, shadow, elemental, psionic, or rune subsystem, the executives won't stop them. They need to just do it by the deadlines.

A new Tome of Battle or Tome if Magic or a lite version is a matter of will.

 

[Tigris]

Now I don't think that the executives would stop the designers. If they decided to make a martial, magic item, shadow, elemental, psionic, or rune subsystem, the executives won't stop them. They need to just do it by the deadlines.

Oh I verry much think they would. No risk, just the same, less is more works well for D&D and they for sure dont want to make fans angry, rather bore them.

 

[Minigiant]

Oh I verry much think they would. No risk, just the same, less is more works well for D&D and they for sure dont want to make fans angry, rather bore them.

I think recent history proves that the executives don't actually know what would make the fans angry and thus would not know if what the designers is doing is something that would make the fans angry.

 

[nevin]

This is my proposed solution to the wizard class:

D&D General Thread 'The Specialist Wizard - the Wizard 2.0'

Oct 25, 2023

Ladies and Gentleman,

I present to you the Wizard 2.0!
He comes with three subclasses: The Specialist, the Generalist and the Bard (okay, the last one is an even bigger experiment, because I my mind, the Bard is an arcane magic user that is basically a wizard who went to Arts school ... if you don't like the bard as a Wizard Subclass, please ignore that and concentrate on the new Design Concept of Wizard Specialist and Generalist).
It comes with:

• 3 Subclasses (Specialist, Generalist and Bard)
• Proficiency and Expertise for Schools of Magic, walling of access to higher spells
• A...

• M_Natas
• Replies: 8
• Forum: *Dungeons & Dragons

• 

The problem is, that they basically don't have much choice. When you go tona burger restaurant, you will pick one of 10 different kind of burgers (classes with spells), yeah, there is the one option that is only fries (thief rogue) or pizza (champion fighter), but not picking a burger when being jn that burger restaurant is kind of silly.
So, now players may be fine with picking characters with spells, but only because that is what is on the menu.
If you broaden the menu players would pick different things.


Yeah, I hate the "everything and their mother are a spell" approach of 5e, even for like classes like the Psion which would really feel distinct, if their powers where not spell (slot) based.

no they won't pick more things. you are seperating things and trying to force them to broaden choices but in the end no matter how you lay the above out there will be a few optimal choice paths and it will most likely end up just like the current wizard. In a game there are always optimal choices depending on the type of game you play. Warriors, rogues and all the other classes suffer the same problem. The only way to broaden the choices people are willing to use is to broaden the types of situations they will have to deal with. It's the fact that the game is for all the supplements and options, mostly narrowly focused on hero's fighting the enemy. Thus Fighting the enemy limits the choices. Just like in an MMO. RAW DPS rules, limiting damage is the second useful thing,and healing multiplies the amount of damage that can be done. Till you break that trinity up you can broaden the menu into 20 books and you'll find players will still take less than 1 percent of the options almost every time once they' played enough to understand what is the most powerful.

 

[nevin]

I think recent history proves that the executives don't actually know what would make the fans angry and thus would not know if what the designers is doing is something that would make the fans angry.

I don't think that's exactly the problem. Things have to change to sell new books and pdf's. The game has been out a long time. Most options have been tried out in some shape or form. So they aggravate people by rinsing washing and repeating the same kinds of things with different coats of paint. No way to avoid aggravating people when the business model requires change that most people have already had, or don't need, or don't want. The new mystic subclass play tests are a perfect example. They are just half caster, half martial or half rogue etc classes. nothing really new except how they are presented.

 

[Minigiant]

I don't think that's exactly the problem. Things have to change to sell new books and pdf's. The game has been out a long time. Most options have been tried out in some shape or form. So they aggravate people by rinsing washing and repeating the same kinds of things with different coats of paint. No way to avoid aggravating people when the business model requires change that most people have already had, or don't need, or don't want. The new mystic subclass play tests are a perfect example. They are just half caster, half martial or half rogue etc classes. nothing really new except how they are presented.

The bolded isn't true.

The only subsystems tried over multiple classes and races or on both the player and DM side in 5e is:

Spells


Not even skills as many monsters in 2014 didn't have skills.

If I were to do 6e, that would the very first thing I change.

 

[nevin]

The bolded isn't true.

The only subsystems tried over multiple classes and races or on both the player and DM side in 5e is:

Spells


Not even skills as many monsters in 2014 didn't have skills.

If I were to do 6e, that would the very first thing I change.

Humanoid monsters have had skills forever. In fact now many of them are races. we've had versions where monsters had skills, we've had versions where they didn't and that doesn't even scratch the surface of all the stuff done by 3rd parties. There is nothing new just variations on the same general themes. It's like trying to have a completly unique fantasy story. No matter how hard you try it'll have strong similarities to stuff from before. That problem will just get worse with every passing year.