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Message: <blockquote data-quote="Mort" data-source="post: 5532423" data-attributes="member: 762">Why should "magic" be the only method built into any class to trancend normalcy? While myths can and should be built through roleplaying and campaign progression, why not have a few options, built into the classes themselves, that allow this to be done mechanically (build wise) other than through magic? For example allow an option for rogues to build a network of informants as they go up in level, and/or give fighters some kind of mythic renown score that may provide aid - even in a foreign land. Where the spellcasters can have access to magic the non-spellcasters may have access to other mythic, but not necessarily magical options. Heck this was the way it was done 2e back, with fighters gaining followers etc. and rogues (I believe I don't have access to my older eddition books at the moment) gaining access to a thieves guild etc. through mechanics of the game.In 3e spellcasting power is quite a bit more immediate gratification than ability to buy stuff. The mage can do all the stuff himself - usually in 6 seconds or less. If there were more constraints placed on magic - well then there would not be this argument (as has been mentioned repeatedly 3e took many of the constraints of prior edditions away).That said, your analogy has merit and it kind of illustrates the point. 3e takes pains to equalize wealth between the classes as levels progress - and stresses over and over that one must watch the unequal distribution of wealth between PCs because it can lead to a serious power differential (note I'm not arguing it should never be done, simply that there are consequences that need to be kept in mind). Yet the progression of the wizard vs. the fighter as levels increase is treated as equal, despite the fact that the wizard gains exponentially more abilities and options. A level 18 fighter and a level 18 mage are treated as the same CR rating for ex. when clearly this is not remotely the case. Essentially, going with your analogy, the classes are "equal" well except the fact that by mid-high levels some have 1000x the gold of the other classes (but we'll pretend that makes no difference).And on another note: what exactly is wrong with giving high level fighters "mythic" options beyond "I hit it pretty hard?" Options could be "leader of men" or "mythic combatant" or "slayer of beasts" (with appropriate bonuses) essentially stuff that truly suits a high level fighter but may/or may not be magical depending on the flavor of the campaign. I suppose that that's what prestige classes/multi-class options are for, and they work ok for the purpose. But it irks me that the mage doesn't really need prestige classes or multiclassing (heck most multi-class options are bad choices for the mage) to do his schtick while the fighter can't get far beyond "big bruiser" without using means other than progression in fighter levels.</blockquote>

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