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Message: <blockquote data-quote="pemerton" data-source="post: 5539992" data-attributes="member: 42582">I can't comment on Hypnotism, as I don't own the Essentials book in question, and don't have any players whose PC uses that power.But I don't  really agree with the notion of "codified behaviour" and "downplay of human adjudication". Page 42, which in the Essentials Rules Companion and DM book is instead folded into the skill descriptions (which canvass various improvisations, with suggested difficulties), is all about human adjudication that isn't codified in advance (although some parameters, in terms of scaling DCs and damage, are suggested).My players have had no trouble doing things like using Twist of Space (a 7th level wizard encounter power with the Teleportation keyword) to free a woman magically trapped inside a mirror, or spreading wrestling oil on the ground to increase the slide distance when using Footwork Lure (a fighter at-will with a forced movement component).The rules text of Hypnotism that you cite shows that it is subject to two basic constraints - no action more powerful or sophisticated than a melee basic attack, and no movement further than slide 3. Keeping those constraints in mind, I don't think I'd have much trouble adjudicating other uses pursuant to page 42.Search me. I just cited the rules from the core books, noted the tension between them, and suggested what seemed to me to be the natural solution.But any 4e player who thinks that the game does not contemplate using fire spells to burn down libraries (as one example) must have simply missed the bit I quoted from the DMG that talks about the GM ruling that paper has vulnerable 5 fire.Or, to come at it in a slightly different fashion - how does a 4e fireball hurt creatures? Because it bathes them in fire (hence, the fire keyword and fire damage). Can it set fire to a library? Yes, because paper bathed in fire will catch alight. What about an attack with an axe? It hurst them because it's a weapon (hence, the weapon keyword). A weapon that, according to the PHB p215, has a "bladed, heavy head" that "deal<s> vicious cuts." Is there any doubt that such a thing can also be used to damage the furniture, or a tree?</s><s></s><s>Here's some more text from p 10 of the PHB:</s><s></s><s>While exploring a dungeon or other adventure location, you might try to do any of the following actions:</s><s></s><s>* Move down a hallway, follow a passage, cross a room</s><s>* Listen by a door to determine if you hear anything on the other side</s><s>* Try a door to see if it’s locked</s><s>* Break down a locked door</s><s>* Search a room for treasure</s><s>* Pull levers, push statues or furnishings around</s><s>* Pick the lock of a treasure chest</s><s>* Jury-rig a trap</s><s></s><s>The Dungeon Master decides whether or not something you try actually works. Some actions automatically succeed (you can move around without trouble, usually), some require one or more die rolls, called checks (breaking down a locked door, for example), and some simply can’t succeed. Your character is capable of any deeds a strong, smart, agile, and well-armed human action hero can pull off. You can’t punch your way through a door of 3-inch-thick iron plate with your bare hands, for example - not unless you have powerful magic to help you out!</s><s>Who, after reading this, really thinks that they need the GM's permission to use an axe to "attack" the furniture (as opposed to adjudicate the outcome of that attack)?</s> <s></s><s>I have no idea, but I personally find the tone of the question a bit one-sided.</s><s></s><s>On another thread earlier this year (maybe "Why 4e is not as popular as it could be"), someone was posting that fireball in 3E noted that it set fire to flammable objects, and that the absence of such text in 4e was a radical departure. I replied that such text, while (if I recall correctly) present in AD&D, was absent in original and Basic/Expert D&D. It's also absent in Rolemaster. To the extent that 4e is different from those other RPGs, I think a big part of that is nothing more than formatting. It's not as if Expert D&D actually talked about fireball doing stuff other than killing foes (it mentions "a missile of fire that burst into a ball of fire" doing Xd6 damage "to each creature within the sphere of fire"). All 4e does is present the same information in a more formal/jargon-laden fashion, rather than in a free text description: "Area burst 3 within 20 squares", "Target: Each creature in burst", etc.</s><s></s><s>I know that some 4e players report that the game lobotomised their players, or lobotimised them as GMs. I haven't had those experiences. Despite its sparse and creature-focused text, my players in Basic/Expert, and Rolemaster,  never had trouble using fireball to start fires. And it's not been an issue in 4e either.</s></blockquote>

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