How noticable is a Paladin using "Detect Evil"

[Master of the Game]

I have a paladin in my group who uses his ability to Detect Evil constantly. Everytime he meets new people he scans them. Recently, he and a few members of my group were knighted for service to the crown, and during the cerimony and the party afterwards he would use the ability to check out most of the noble court.

Of course, in court everyone that had reason to was using magic to disguise their alignment, but still, can you tell when a paladin uses his ability or when he is scanning you?

 

[Viktyr Gehrig]

I'd say they can notice he's staring at them. It might leave open to question whether he's interested in their soul or their body, and for which purpose he's interested in either.

For fun, have one of the nobles notice, and come up "I've noticed you looking at me..." and have the noble either flirt or provoke the Paladin (based on respective genders).

 

[niteshade6]

Well it's noticable enough to draw an attack of oppurtunity in combat, although you could argue that's partial due to dropping your defence as well. Other then that it's probably up to the individual DM, there are no somatic or verbal components required so it might be tricky to spot. But I'd certainly give anyone with spellcraft a shot at figuring out that something wierd was going on.

 

[Hypersmurf]

Don't forget the three-round progression, either.

First round only tells him if there's any evil in the 60 foot quarter-circle in front of him.

Second round only tells him how many evil auras there are.

If he wants to know which of those nobles are evil, it's not until the third round that he can match auras to people... that's 18 seconds of "zoning out".

It's not the most subtle trick in town.

-Hyp.

 

[Master of the Game]

Don't forget the three-round progression, either.

First round only tells him if there's any evil in the 60 foot quarter-circle in front of him.

Second round only tells him how many evil auras there are.

If he wants to know which of those nobles are evil, it's not until the third round that he can match auras to people... that's 18 seconds of "zoning out".

It's not the most subtle trick in town.

-Hyp.

Good point, thank you. I've been a bit too lenient about time outside of the combat environment, but 18 seconds in a social situation is a bit much...

I'd say they can notice he's staring at them. It might leave open to question whether he's interested in their soul or their body, and for which purpose he's interested in either.

For fun, have one of the nobles notice, and come up "I've noticed you looking at me..." and have the noble either flirt or provoke the Paladin (based on respective genders).

OMG, I love this. It's going to have to happen....

Thanks all.

 

[Herremann the Wise]

Actually, in technical terms I have to disagree.

It's a spell-like ability which means that there is concentration involved. However, if the Paladin is just standing around, it is not obvious. In fact it most probably looks like he's doing a scan of the area during the first round. This is pretty much the behaviour of any proficient fighter type being on guard and checking for threats. If the Paladin does not sense evil, the attempt's all over. It's only if the Paladin persists with this behaviour by focusing on individuals that people will feel the Gaze of the Paladin and like Hypersmurf says, it then becomes pretty obvious.
As well, if he tries to do it while others are interacting with him, it could lead to interesting and obvious results.

However, as a person who enjoys playing the Paladin, I'm a little disturbed by your nerfing his ability by letting all those nobles have a way of knocking out his radar - most unsportsmanlike. Now does the Paladin go around poisoning and backstabbing all your bad guys? No. So let him have his fun with his little ability.

In all seriousness though, sometimes the best thing to do with a Player who has to stare down every square inch of your, dungeon, city or heaven forbid wilderness is to take them aside and give them a chat. Tell them that it's getting annoying. However, if you want to make them feel special, tell them you'll give them a wink if they start feeling uneasy - that evil is possibly present. This saves a lot of time and it will remind them that a Paladin can and should be doing more things than using their detect evil ability.
Alternatively, if they are in a large confined area - a dungeon - tell them that they sense a feint evil all over the place - see the lingering table on p193 of the PHB for details.

Best Regards
Herremann the Wise

 

[Master of the Game]

I don't really want to nerf his ability. Like you said though, it does get a bit annoying, and if it was noticeable that he always acts in a certain way, sooner or later someone might figure out what the paladin is doing and put a stop to it.

I don't intend to have every evil noble keep his guard up all the time, nor do I wish for the ability to become useless or secondary. It just seems obvious to me that those with the money and power to disguise their thoughts / motivations / alignment would do so while in a good-aligned court. Further, if it is obvious in some way, then those who do have their guard up and are careful of such scrutiny should have some chance of detecting it.

My thought was perhaps a Sense Motive check for those who know he is a paladin (of Tyr, a god of justice) and capable of such things once he reaches the third round.

 

[shilsen]

One other way to deal with this tactic is to just use alignment as written.

The typical alignment for humans is neutral. So a good human is just as unusual as an evil one. In any fair-sized group of people, a paladin should detect a number of them as evil. That doesn't mean they are a danger to him or his party, any more than that a good NPC is automatically helpful to them. So making judgement calls on just the basis of detected evil alignment wil get him into trouble more often than not.

Also, detect evil detects auras, so it is not particularly reliable. An NPC with a moderate evil aura could be a 20th lvl Ftr, a disguised vampire Wiz7, a 3rd lvl Clr, etc. Not to mention the effect of spells.

Alignment is only detectable by clerics, paladins, and rangers in 3e, so it is not likely to have much (if any) of a role in society and under the law. Being CE would not be illegal or a problem for an individual as long as he did nothing untoward in society, and most evil NPCs would neither know their own alignment nor care about it. Using magical means to hide it would not be all that common, simply because it would be unnecessary.

So the detect evil ability does not really help all that much, and is a lot less of a problem than it is often considered to be.

 

[0-hr]

They really should have put some sort of limit on that (1/day per level or some such). It's just too annoying otherwise. And ahving it work though doors and walls?! yeesh.

 

[Artoomis]

It's a spell-like ability that requires concentration. That means:

1. It's noticeable to some degree - although it's only noticeable that he's concentrating.

2. A spellcraft check should show what's going on. It may not show "Detect Evil" - but certainly that "Detect Something" is happening. I'd allow a "spellcraft check" to be done as soon as someone notices that he's concentrating - and that's fairly obvious.

3. It's a social faux pas, as best, to be Detecting Evil all the time. The 18 seconds of concentration is simply not acceptable in a social context.