Imaculata
Hero
Well perhaps I misread the title of the thread then.
How to deal with death in RPG?
Well perhaps I misread the title of the thread then.
jasper
Rotten DM
Strong Taboo. hahahahaah Skully has 51 names. I roll out in the open and occasionally split attacks over pcs. But if the pc dies, the pc dies. I don't do quests to get pc back up. Either have the party cast a raise, or pay the gold pieces and bring back the dead.
If the game you are playing have death on the line, should the monsters try to win too?
Ovinomancer
No flips for you!
I'm trying a new houserule in my current game: PCs don't die unless the player says so. They still go down, and if they don't die, I get to be mean about it. Had 1 TPK 5 sessions in as a serious test, and it's worked great. I chose to unwind one PC's successes in his personal goal, setting a difficult challenge in the way. I flipped two other PC's backstories on thier heads, causing some serious reflection on what they thought they knew, and I had the Grave domain cleric become haunted. Everyone at the table has loved it so far. Their characters hate it, though.
For me, I realized character dearh really only punishes players. I'm trying out punishing characters instead.
For me, I realized character dearh really only punishes players. I'm trying out punishing characters instead.
I definitely find the possibility of (permanent) PC death makes D&D and similar games much more exciting & involving for me. But it doesn't have to be frequent; like the death penalty it can be almost arbitrarily rare and still have the desired effect. Some of my favourite campaigns were the ones were amazingly no one died in dozens of sessions. And D&D is cleverly structured to make (permanent) PC death less and less likely as the game goes on.
Checking the logs of my Primeval Thule campaign - https://simonsprimevalthule.blogspot.com/ - it feels very very dangerous; wildly unbalanced encounters, no raise dead, 1st level PCs in "level 4-6" or "level 5-8" adventures. 12 sessions in, 1 PC death - that was the guy who betrayed the rest of the party, broke the anti-summoning ward they had sweated blood to create, ran off and left them with the summoned demons.... ...and ran right into a cavern of waiting Shadows. I have to say I don't think anyone but the player wept too much for that PC.
I think the wildly unbalanced encounters (& lack of raise dead) may be a reason for the lack of PC death - players feel comfortable running away when the Abominable Sloth comes crashing into the camp of their level 1 PCs. Whereas in a kill-everything game they might feel obliged to fight it for the XP.
Checking the logs of my Primeval Thule campaign - https://simonsprimevalthule.blogspot.com/ - it feels very very dangerous; wildly unbalanced encounters, no raise dead, 1st level PCs in "level 4-6" or "level 5-8" adventures. 12 sessions in, 1 PC death - that was the guy who betrayed the rest of the party, broke the anti-summoning ward they had sweated blood to create, ran off and left them with the summoned demons.... ...and ran right into a cavern of waiting Shadows. I have to say I don't think anyone but the player wept too much for that PC.
I think the wildly unbalanced encounters (& lack of raise dead) may be a reason for the lack of PC death - players feel comfortable running away when the Abominable Sloth comes crashing into the camp of their level 1 PCs. Whereas in a kill-everything game they might feel obliged to fight it for the XP.
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I was playing in a live-action game this weekend as an NPC, in which I helped with a scene that was the PCs death.
The game, as a whole, makes PC death difficult - it is a cyberpunk world in which they frequently take a snapshot of the PC's mind, and if they die, they are put into a new body. There is a chance of the copy degrading, and this goes up the more often you do it. So, there's some chance of repercussion, but rarely would this end the character. The game is in its third year, the ninth or tenth session, I think, and no PC has permanently died.
And, for these players (30+ of them), the loss of the threat of death really hasn't sapped their fun, ingenuity, or the like - because not being able to die does not mean they are sure to succeed at anything. In this game, there are no fights for the purpose of killing things and taking their loot - the combat scenes are missions with goals that matter to the game world and PCs. If they fall in a combat in which terrorists are trying to set off a nuclear bomb, that bomb is going to explode and take an entire city with it. They have enough empathy to find that putting other things and people at risk is a good motivator to intelligent play.
In this case, the player had found that their character sounded good when they started, but in practice, was becoming much less fun over time, and they wanted to change.
So, with player permission, we killed off that character pretty violently. The other characters in the game were not aware this was going to happen, so we got to surprise them with it, and push all the fun emotional buttons that go with it.
The game, as a whole, makes PC death difficult - it is a cyberpunk world in which they frequently take a snapshot of the PC's mind, and if they die, they are put into a new body. There is a chance of the copy degrading, and this goes up the more often you do it. So, there's some chance of repercussion, but rarely would this end the character. The game is in its third year, the ninth or tenth session, I think, and no PC has permanently died.
And, for these players (30+ of them), the loss of the threat of death really hasn't sapped their fun, ingenuity, or the like - because not being able to die does not mean they are sure to succeed at anything. In this game, there are no fights for the purpose of killing things and taking their loot - the combat scenes are missions with goals that matter to the game world and PCs. If they fall in a combat in which terrorists are trying to set off a nuclear bomb, that bomb is going to explode and take an entire city with it. They have enough empathy to find that putting other things and people at risk is a good motivator to intelligent play.
In this case, the player had found that their character sounded good when they started, but in practice, was becoming much less fun over time, and they wanted to change.
So, with player permission, we killed off that character pretty violently. The other characters in the game were not aware this was going to happen, so we got to surprise them with it, and push all the fun emotional buttons that go with it.
I
Immortal Sun
Guest
It's going to depend on so many factors its hard to give you a good answer. Is the system you're playing anti-death? Death-aplenty? Something else? Does the system have suggestions for how to handle death? What sort of game style do you enjoy? How do you want to treat your players?
I don't think killing players is taboo. But I generally set up my game with the expectation that the players will win. However, death is usually a risk, but it's typically death by stupidity. Most cases of "this has a chance to kill you" will be pretty clear, and players who ignore them walk headlong into their deaths. How things are dealt with from there depends on the party, both players and PCs. Do the other PCs care about the guy who just died? Does the dead PC's player want to resume playing that character? Does the PC's death move the story forward or backwards?
There's a million factors to consider both in-game and out-of-game.
Personally, I don't care for random death, I find it boring as a DM and a PC. I enjoy meaningful death, but I don't see a lot of that in D&D.
I don't think killing players is taboo. But I generally set up my game with the expectation that the players will win. However, death is usually a risk, but it's typically death by stupidity. Most cases of "this has a chance to kill you" will be pretty clear, and players who ignore them walk headlong into their deaths. How things are dealt with from there depends on the party, both players and PCs. Do the other PCs care about the guy who just died? Does the dead PC's player want to resume playing that character? Does the PC's death move the story forward or backwards?
There's a million factors to consider both in-game and out-of-game.
Personally, I don't care for random death, I find it boring as a DM and a PC. I enjoy meaningful death, but I don't see a lot of that in D&D.
Zhaleskra
Adventurer
I'm starting to have a problem with the concept of "random death", in that, I don't think it's actually random. You got into or were forced into a fight and chose not to flee when losing, or you didn't check for traps (or failed your find traps roll) and triggered the trap you didn't find (until now).
The possibility of so-called "random" deaths is what separates a "serious" RPG from a book, movie, or play for me. That said, it's not everyone's GMing or playing style, so go with what works for you.
The possibility of so-called "random" deaths is what separates a "serious" RPG from a book, movie, or play for me. That said, it's not everyone's GMing or playing style, so go with what works for you.
How about we not put things that the Supreme Court has to argue over in as evidence of what RPGs should do, or how RPGs operate, please and thank you.
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