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Message: <blockquote data-quote="ECMO3" data-source="post: 9465120" data-attributes="member: 7030563">Not in any game I played and I am currently playing 4 games a week with 4 different groups worldwide and Ranger is the most common class I play.   It is simple math.No it is not, but the math holds true regardless.  10 enemies, 1 enemy, unless your fights are abnormally long the math is the math.How many enemies do you fight in the average encounter?  This is easy to calculate.If your Ranger picks a foe and shoots and ignores the enemy that the rest of the party is targeting then yes it will last a lot longer on that foe, but then the party as a whole is getting negative value out of Hunter's Mark.  The mechanics rely heavily on action economy and eliminating enemy actions is better than the extra damage you will get by targeting an enemy by yourself just to get the Hunter's Mark extra damage.Yes in the 4 games a week I play with different groups wordlwide and in the all the streaming games online I watched and in the games the you tube optimizers have talked about.I am sure there are a small amount of games where Rangers can sit Hunter's MArk on a target regularly and get damage from it, but I think those games represent a very small minority.It is a very valid assumption at the vast majority of tables.Sure, but a Beastmaster build or a Drakewarden build or a Horizon Walker build can't.  Nor can builds that multiclass Rogue or Monk or Paladin or builds that play Goblins or Earth Genasi or Eladrins or Shaddar Kai ......Yes some builds can do this though.Most of my Rangers I played as a player did not use it for TWF a whole lot actually and they never used Hunter's Mark because they never had it on their spell list past level 3.  They did occasionally have Hex.On builds that did use HM or Hex having Twin spell makes a big difference on how often you can use your bonus action though.That is ok.  You can think that, but I can back mine up with a ton of experience with Rangers as both a player and a DM.I think your statement is the one that is wrong as a general assumption and the various videos of optimizers support this.Further the math doesn't lie, so tell me how many rounds and how many enemies on average and we can figure this out real easy.Yeah and if you concentrate on the minions you have to move your mark a lot (like every round).If you concentrate on the big bad your attacks really do nothing for action economy until the minions are down, if you concentrate on the minions (as you should) you move your mark a lot.Keep in mind damage is just a number and is only indirectly related to effectiveness.Ok so Conjure Barrage and you are not using your Hunter's Mark.  The whol premise is if you want to use your MArk.The Wizard blasts the minions to near death and then you can attack them and kill them (and not use your Mark) or attack the big bad to get that extra damage.The math is the math and it does not matter what the party size is.  Whether you party is 1 PC or 10 PCs if you are going to kill 4 enemies in 4 rounds you are going to have one dying every round.</blockquote>

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