How to stop a Warlock in his tracks

[Saeviomagy]

That's pretty much what I said.

My point was that it does't matter how many "V" only spells you have available, there are only two that really matter when you are grappled, and you have a very narrow window to use them in.

Heaven forbid you are faced by intelligent, prepared opponents who cast silence on their grappler before he charges and grapples you. (A tactic my character has used in the past.)

Ah, so your point is that in the case where a sorceror is targeted and grappled in the surprise round by an individual affected by a silence spell and he doesn't know the feat sudden silent spell, he's in the same situation as any warlock who's simply been grappled at any time, and therefore the warlock is no weaker in this situation than any other spellcaster.

Interesting stance to take...

 

[Caliban]

Ah, so your point is that in the case where a sorceror is targeted and grappled in the surprise round by an individual affected by a silence spell and he doesn't know the feat sudden silent spell, he's in the same situation as any warlock who's simply been grappled at any time, and therefore the warlock is no weaker in this situation than any other spellcaster.

Interesting stance to take...

I don't believe I referred to the warlock in any fashion.

Why are you atrtributing things to me I never said or implied?

That seems pretty dishonest to me, and I find it offensive.

I really don't think I'm interested in your opinion any longer.

 

[Savage Wombat]

I still can't find the place where it says all invocations require somatic. Page number?

 

[Particle_Man]

p.7, under armor and weapon proficiency section "all invocations, including eldritch blast, have a somatic component"

 

[Saeviomagy]

I don't believe I referred to the warlock in any fashion.

Are you posting in this thread? The one about warlocks?

Why are you atrtributing things to me I never said or implied?

I'm not. You said half of them and implied the other half.

That seems pretty dishonest to me, and I find it offensive.

I really don't think I'm interested in your opinion any longer.

Wah wah wah I'm taking my toys and going home?

Let me recap the thread for those hard of thinking.

"The warlock is screwed if he get's grappled, right?"
"Including eldritch blast?"
"He might get out with his better BAB"
"Maybe hideous blow would work, or quicken spell like ability"
"Better get a cape of the montebank"
"Even eldritch blast has a somatic, so that's no good"
"Don't all spellcasters have a critical weakness against grapples?"

Now, I'll slow this replay down at this point, so we catch everything. This is the important bit:

Me: "No, most spellcasters will find they've got spells that they can still cast which will let them get away."
Caliban: "They only get a round to escape, or they'll be pinned and unable to speak, and since only wizards can use silent spell, sorcerors are out of luck"
Me: "Well, they shouldn't be waiting that round then, should they?"
Caliban: "That's what I said. Against an intelligent foe with a silence spell up, they're in even bigger trouble."

Note this carefully - the point of my inital post in the exchange was "warlocks are more in trouble in grapple than most casters, because they cannot cast without a somatic component, while most casters will still have some spells available".

So - when a warlock is grappled, he's out of luck. None of his magic will work and there is no feat or counter tactic he can use to reliably avoid this.

When a wizard/sorceror is grappled, doesn't escape via spell, is pinned on the subsequent round, and doesn't have a silent spell or the feat sudden silent spell OR doesn't have a dimension door memorised, he is out of luck. Note all the tactics, spells and feats which would have allowed him to escape if he'd made use of them.

Now - did caliban really not say
"in the case where a sorceror is targeted and grappled in the surprise round by an individual affected by a silence spell and he doesn't know the feat sudden silent spell, he's in the same situation as any warlock who's simply been grappled at any time, and therefore the warlock is no weaker in this situation than any other spellcaster."

Admittedly he didn't say the "surprise round" bit - I put that in, because I wouldn't expect a sorceror or wizard to be much seperated from the party otherwise.

 

[Dinkeldog]

Please be nice to one another and not try to read into other people's posts what isn't there. Also, please don't take offense when there is no need for it. Thanks --Dinkeldog

 

[Caliban]

Blah, blah, blah.

Until you want to discuss this in a civil, honest manner, I really don't care what you have to say.

 

[Dinkeldog]

Now you see. A better response would have been no response. Please see post #26 above, thank you.

 

[Veldrane]

Just a thought... ...all Invocations have somatic components.
Flee the scene, that has its only use in escaping grapples (since the range is too short to escape combat), has in its text: " you can use Dimension Door as a spell like ability [...].
Note that it's the only Invocation where the text say: "as a SLA" instead of "as the spell".
Could it imply that you can use it without somatic components?

 

[Caliban]

Now you see. A better response would have been no response. Please see post #26 above, thank you.

I read your post, it didn't apply to this. I didn't read anything extra into his post, he inclearly intended it to be offensive. I simply let him know that I don't find that behavior acceptable, and I won't carry on a discussion with him as long as he continues to act that way.