I like Psionics but...........

[BluWolf]

I have NEVER played or allowed psionics in my campaigns over the past 22 years. I always liked the idea of psionics in literature and in comics but I always felt they didn't belong in my fantasy worlds. Yes, this is because the first book I ever read was Tolkien and I'm a narrow minded fantasy biggot, but bygones.

When I started rewriting my homebrew 2 years ago I started with a picture in mind. The fantasy world equivalent of the Mos Eisley cantina. I wanted a very wierd and disjointed world where players could play or meet just about anything. I wanted oddity to be a mainstay of the world. Not in a Robert Asprin (sp??) light hearted comedy way but in a Flash Gordon otherwordly stereotypical way.

So one thing I said to self was "self, hang up your psionic prejudice and allow them." OK fine.

I bought the psionics hand book read it, liked it but decided I wasn't going to bring them in until I got a good feel for the core mechanics of 3E. Baby steps of complexity.

Well it has been two years since the restart of my campaign and I find myself on hiatus for an extended period with some time to do some tiding and some expanision. But now the problem I have is I cannot see a reason for psionics in the game. It just seems to me to be a shadow of the magic system.

You have wizards, sorcerers, clerics, druids......they all cast spells differently but when you get all the window dressing out of the way they are essentially all using the same mechanic. So why add psions, psychic warriors and all that other stuff when it is essentially the same thing, different curtains???

I would like to make psionics an option for those in my campaign that are interested in it but I'm not feeling the love.

Has anyone been running a "psionics is different form magic" campaign? How successful has it been? How challenging has it been? Where are the pitfalls?

Much appreciated;

 

[Psion]

Personally, I don't use the psionics are different rule (even made psionics another form of magic even back in 2e), so I can't help you there.

However, I thought I might pipe in to tell you that the Psionics Toolkit (by fiery dragon) may be a good option for you. It has lots of thoughts on bringing psionics into a fantasy game for those that don't already have it in their games.

Other than that, if the players aren't into it, you might try to showcase it with one or two (don't overdo it) interesting psionic NPCs that they can see in action.

 

[Leopold]

I made a deal with my players.

ME "Ok folks you want to run psionic PC"?
Unshaven Masses: "YES!"
ME:"Ok if you start taking levels in Psionic classes then the creatures that are psionic in the book will get their abilities just like you."
UM: "Like mindflayers and aboleth and stuff getting psionics?"
ME: "Yup"
UM: "ummm we'll think about it"

and that's the last i heard about it.

 

[Selganor]

Did you try the "Psionics Toolkit" from Fiery Dragon ?

Chapter One (the only chapter not OGC) has 12 questions a DM might ask himself in regard to psionics in a campaign/world. After you answered these questions you will have a good idea of how psionics are integrated in a campaign.

It also has a few other ways to introduce Psionics: A god, a race, a monolith, a plague, ...

If you still are not sure what psionics will do to a campaign you might want to start a new campaign with "Of Sound Mind" (also by Fiery Dragon) which features some spionic effects that might vanish without a trace after the group has solved the problems in the adventure (or might stay and be included into a campaign that wasn't planned to include psionics in the first place..)

All three to four campaigns I DMed or played in with psionics so far used the psionics=magic rule, everything else would be FAR too complicated...

 

[StalkingBlue]

Hmm. Fighters, barbarians, rogues, rangers, clerics, paladins use much the same game mechanics in their melee attacks, and nobody argues much about why we have so of those hack 'n slashing classes around.
So I'm not sure how far the argument about the similarity of mechanics carries.

I have never yet played or run psionic characters, so I can't really help you much - but I expect psions to be very different from magic users in "feel", what with their crystals, displays, not even mentioning their specific personal and cultural style. I'll have a chance to test this very soon, as player of a psion in somebody else's campaign. If this thread is still alive by then, I can let you know how it went.

 

[BluWolf]

No one has had the temerity to attempt the psionics as different approach??

 

[barsoomcore]

It takes temerity?

Yeah, I use "psionics are different". But then I'm pretty much using "magic is different", too, so it doesn't really count.

I love psionics. Here's how I look at it. There are two basic modes of magic: Preset and On The Fly. Preset includes all PHB spellcasters except sorcerers. All these spellcasters have to choose which spells they'll use that day ahead of time. They can't (except under certain conditions) swap out one spell for another just because they need that spell. On The Fly spellcasters (the sorcerer) can pick and choose their spells when they need them.

Psions are On The Fly spellcasters. The difference between Psions and Sorcerers is the "chunkiness" of their choices. Sorcerers can pick and choose, sure, but they're restricted to a certain number of spells per level. Psions, on the other hand, can use their point in any combination they like. So a sixth-level sorcerer can do 1 third-level spell and four 1st-level (or whatever) -- they can't instead do TWO third-level. A Psion could, assuming the points worked out.

It's a subtle difference in the mechanic, but it is most definitely a difference.

So, no, Psionics are not identical to existing spellcasters. No more so than they are identical to each other, at least.

And spellcasters don't have psionic attack and defense modes to worry about, either.

I don't really see your point, I guess is what I'm saying. If you don't like psionics, then fine, don't use them. But what exactly are you complaining about? I don't get it.

 

[Carnifex]

When I started rewriting my homebrew 2 years ago I started with a picture in mind. The fantasy world equivalent of the Mos Eisley cantina. I wanted a very wierd and disjointed world where players could play or meet just about anything. I wanted oddity to be a mainstay of the world.

Now to make a comment with nothing to do with psionics but what you've detailed here sounds mightily like Planescape would suit your desires well

And on a psionics note; I've never really had any problems with including psionics as 'psi is different'. Their feel is usually brilliantly 'alien' due to the sheer wierdness inherent in all their crystal stuff, psionic tattoo's etc.

 

[jmucchiello]

I have NEVER played or allowed psionics in my campaigns over the past 22 years. I always liked the idea of psionics in literature and in comics but I always felt they didn't belong in my fantasy worlds. Yes, this is because the first book I ever read was Tolkien and I'm a narrow minded fantasy biggot, but bygones.

I don't want to start a Tolkien discussion but why do you attribute to magic the mental abilities of Galadriel? Just because the word psionic doesn't appear in his work doesn't mean that they aren't there. I don't think the word magic appears in those passages (between Frodo and Galadriel) either. I could be very wrong.

Still, why do they have to be different? The various psion subclasses are very different from any of the magic types if they are played correctly. The only reason to keep magic and psionics as the same is to save yourself from pulling your hair out when something the psionicist does cannot be undone with dispel magic.

Joe Mucchiello
Throwing Dice Games
http://www.throwingdice.com

 

[Jeremy]

I personally thought that the "psionics are different" rules would have serious mechanical liabilities but I was outvoted in my group because too many others felt that magic is magic and psionics are psionics.

The major problem with this is you have to immediately consider how prevalent psionicists are, if they are equal to sorcerers in number then it'll probably work out alright, but if they are as rare as they tend to be in the homebrews I've played, you run into some serious problems.

First off, you can't dispel psionics all of a sudden. Psionic scry's aren't hedged out by magical spells. BBEG's and powerful characters suddenly have to have two different sets of protections. Protections from magicks AND protection from psionics.

Problems with this have been few and far between, but they have arisen.

I personally believe it would have been easier to say arcanists use magic of the universe, priests use the magic of the gods, and psionicists use magic of the mind and body. External, Divine, and Internal magic. Divine magic affects arcane normally, why should mental effects not work upon divine or arcane or vice versa?