I Seem To Be Embarking on Something Quite Rare

[Presto2112]

I've been trying to assemble some adventures for a quasi-campaign for my group. It basically centers around Baalzebul attempting to improve his lot by gaining a larger foothol on the Material Plane by trying to overrun a continent with insects and bug-like creatures and assorted devils and minions.

I've gone through quite a lot of published adventures. I've seen a lot of Demon-based ones. heck, Demogorgon himself features in over half a dozen! But there aren't a whole lot of adventures where devils feature centrally. I was a little disappointed at this. A LOT of drow, undead, and Dragon-centric adventures, but almost no devils, except as bit players.

Are devils harder to write for? Are they simply not as popular, or are they not as fun?

 

[Whizbang Dustyboots]

If nothing else, you'd expect them to be REALLY competent and organized. I think that's probably intimidating to write, especially in a serial format, whereas demonic plans would naturally lend themselves to a piecemeal approach by publishers.

 

[el-remmen]

Why not use the demon-based plots as smaller portions of the larger devil one?

I see devils as being more about corrupting people's values and loyalty to law and tradition. The type that use philosophical tricks and circumlocution to trick people down the wrong path (as opposed to demons, which I see making mittens out of baby skins and then feeding the flayed babies to their parents).

So, why not use the fear and horror of these demons (perhaps manipulated into their more crude plots) as a means of turning people against the their better intentions in order to feel safer?

You could even have some devil as a re-occurring character, or even a party patron, leading them to more and more morally gray situations that make them perhaps question their ethics. . .

Just a quick one off the head. . . I am all for making use of what I find and twisting it to fit what I want. . .

 

[KrazyHades]

Yah, the important thing is that since in a devil's plan, EVERYTHING would have been pre-planned and completely set up, with dozens of fall-back plans (all planned over hundreds of years!), so you would have to make them ready for anything. They would have agents throughout the major cities and even most towns, there would be hidden caches of gold and items to be used/sold by their minions if necessary. Circles within circles. The devil would NEVER openly show himself. Instead, say, the party would think it was all the fault of, say, the high priest of the Dark Temple, but he was being manipulated by the leader of the assassin-monk guild, who in turn was manipulated by the clever sucubbus disguised as his lover, who was controlled by a powerful dark wizard, who in turn was possessed by a demon controlled by Greater Geas to in turn obey the devil.

Now you can see why people don't make many devil-based adventures. But they are fun, and very much worth it.

 

[Voadam]

Spoilers for a couple modules featuring devils

[SBLOCK]2e A paladin in Hell

3e Lord of the Iron Fortress

3e Tsar Rising (Monkeygod)

3.5 Hellspike Prison

3.5 Hellstone Deep (Monkeygod)

3.5 Dungeon Interludes (Goodman Games)[/SBLOCK]

 

[Voadam]

To make a counterargument to points made above.

Devils can be as dumb as anyone else. Lawful does not necessarily mean well planned. Stupidly loyal evil dedicated to its cause fits LE well.

 

[KrazyHades]

Alright, I've showed the way I've personally always done it. After all, he is the mastermind of the whole thing, so he should be a smart in a lawful way. That's my reasoning, anyways

 

[I'm A Banana]

Well, I can't help you in general, but maybe specifically....

Spoiler

In the next adventure in the War of the Burning Sky campaign saga...

A devil features prominently as an antagonist

(hoping Russ and Ryan don't get angry at me... for that... )

 

[Nifft]

Since we're discussing devil MO vs. demon MO, here's my pair of coppers:

The Demonic impetus is to corrupt, to change, to spawn. Their infinite variety comes from their primal chaotic nature. They are alive, and enjoy life, but value strength over valor, pleasure over morality, and power over loyalty. To a demon, each individual's fall is like a beautiful snowflake. They want to catch you all... no, they've got to catch you all.


The Diabolical impetus brooks no disobedience. They would rather see the universe dead and re-animated as mindless obedient minions than see any spark of hope or defiance. They want you dead. All of you. Now.


So, a Devil will gladly help a Wizard research a city-killing spell, because more dead humans are what they want, while a Demon would be happier corrupting a single good person.

Cheers, -- N

 

[Presto2112]

Why not use the demon-based plots as smaller portions of the larger devil one?

I see devils as being more about corrupting people's values and loyalty to law and tradition. The type that use philosophical tricks and circumlocution to trick people down the wrong path (as opposed to demons, which I see making mittens out of baby skins and then feeding the flayed babies to their parents).

So, why not use the fear and horror of these demons (perhaps manipulated into their more crude plots) as a means of turning people against the their better intentions in order to feel safer?

You could even have some devil as a re-occurring character, or even a party patron, leading them to more and more morally gray situations that make them perhaps question their ethics. . .

Just a quick one off the head. . . I am all for making use of what I find and twisting it to fit what I want. . .

That's what I intend to do - for some low-level stuff, anyway. There's an adventure called Darwell's tower which involves an undead-summoning MacGuffin that I changed to a devil-summoning MacGuffin, and the end-boss from some sort of ghoul to a barghest (not an actual devil, per se, but close enough for my needs).

Another Dungeon adventure, called Beast of Burden, I switched up from a fortress-carrying magical beast from the Beastlands carrying a troop of gnolls around, terrorizing the woodlands, to a colossal fortress-carrying siege crab carrying a troop of kuo-toa around. Siege Crabs are classified as vermin, and thus fit well with my Bugs thing.