If not magic items, then what?

[Fifth Element]

You must have played a very different 1/2e than I. I certainly adventured for loot. Every DnD game I heard tell of, adventured for loot. Every game I heard tell of that didn't adventure for loot, rapidly faded into disinterest.

My personal experience (and every game I heard tell of) counters your own, causing this portion of the thread to collapse in on itself and cease to be. Future generations will puzzle over it for decades.

 

[Mustrum_Ridcully]

Just like Magic: the Gathering cards, some magic items will be only available at sanctioned WotC events.

New Magic Item(Extremely Rare) High Holy Hat of Hating.

The wearer of this hat is allowed to rant and/or spew hatred about whatever he/she wants without fear of being banned from messageboards, humorously "misquoted," or insulted in any way shape or form. Oh, and you're immune to Baleful Polymorph too.

1) Totally unrealistic. The hat seems pretty common in the real world.
2) Shouldn't it provide Regeneration 5/Acid & Fire?

 

[broghammerj]

Seriously.

I can't dispute that killing things and taking their neat stuff isn't a valid way to play D&D, however as a player I find the advancement of my character's story a far more worthwhile reward. Stuff loses its meaning over time. At least for me. I realize there needs to be a reward mechanic in place in the game. But making it "more stuff" always feels so cheap to me; D&D becomes about the acquisition of stuff. Makes me feel all dirty.

I would agree with you as a whole. Killing a foe and stealing his +2 longsword is a bit boring. However, acquiring stuff while in the face of advancing the story is awesome!

Case in point....During the Age of Worms, we unearthed artifacts from the Wind Duke's tomb which were pretty cool, all along while adventuring to defeat the evil Kyuss. Magic items that are linked to advancing story plot are hella cool and seem to be the best of both worlds.

 

[Kintara]

Well, you know, money is a pretty good treasure, or art and fine goods.

 

[HukdUnFonx]

Magic items will still be a reward, they just won't be essential to be competitive within the CR system. I guess they'll no longer affect the key numbers - armor class, to hit, damage, hit points and saves - but will provide other bennies instead.

The question remains how much of a bennie though. Folding boat or belt of battle?

This is an interesting idea I hadn't really considered before. However, if you're doing that, how would you avoid replacing your "Christmas tree" of worn magic items with "Santa's bag" of niche folding boats, portable holes, and crystal balls? Is that not a problem?

My guess is PCs will end up with more interesting/fun items and fewer "necessary" items. Also, with 30 levels instead of 20 in the core, but a slower power scale, I imagine leveling up a little more often will be seen as a reward by some.

Also interesting, I think. I'm still not sure that leveling more often totally makes up for the unpredictability a new magic item gives to the game, in the sense that a player's always expecting to get experience, but a fancy new sword is a surprise bonus. It might be sufficient to fill in the gaps between infrequent magic items, though.

Personally, I'd had the gut feeling that Wizards would just limit the number of wearable magic item slots more severely or simply give a maximum number of items worn, doing away with the 'slot' concept entirely, and I wasn't sure whether I liked that. I'm much more keen on some of these other suggestions.

 

[eve_of_dante]

In the Fighter section of R&C there's a lot of reference to special armours crafted by each race, so perhaps that takes the place of magic armour for some classes/the early levels?
Wizards can also craft their own implements apparently...

Interestingly, there was no mention of magic armour, merely magic shields, greaves and vambraces.

 

[Lurks-no-More]

This is an interesting idea I hadn't really considered before. However, if you're doing that, how would you avoid replacing your "Christmas tree" of worn magic items with "Santa's bag" of niche folding boats, portable holes, and crystal balls? Is that not a problem?

Less so, I think, because a) there are so many combinations of such stuff; this means you won't get four characters in the party who all have roughly the same magic items; b) such items are certainly useful, but not as universally useful as the Doodah of primary ability +6 and, c) with the characters gaining more abilities on their own, there is less of a problem of a marked difference in adventuring efficiency between a character who's used his hard-won gold to buy land or houses, throw elaborate parties etc., and another who's blown everything on equipment.

 

[Lanefan]

Less so, I think, because a) there are so many combinations of such stuff; this means you won't get four characters in the party who all have roughly the same magic items; b) such items are certainly useful, but not as universally useful as the Doodah of primary ability +6 and, c) with the characters gaining more abilities on their own, there is less of a problem of a marked difference in adventuring efficiency between a character who's used his hard-won gold to buy land or houses, throw elaborate parties etc., and another who's blown everything on equipment.

If this holds true, two thumbs up.

It is entirely possible that the base model will feature fewer "rewards" overall...meaning, of course, that each one will mean more. We'll get the answer once H1 comes out, by the treasure amounts it has, as to where they're going with this.

Lanefan

 

[BlueBlackRed]

More money and castles to build.

 

[ogre]

One thing that's bothered me has been the vast accumulation of wealth (gp). In 2e, there was nothing to buy with it (unless the DM allowed magic stores), in 3e there's plently of stuff to buy.... but I have to question.
Why must the gp reward increase depending on your level. Why can't a treasure be 43gp or if your really lucky 250gp, even at 9th, 15th or 25th level?
I've always hated this aspect, where thousands of gp becomes the norm until the pcs are as rich as kings.
I hope 4e has a more realistic economic system, where vast personal wealth tops at a few hundred gp, unless you have a castle or some other 'thing' to bleed your gold.