Menu
News
All News
Dungeons & Dragons
Level Up: Advanced 5th Edition
Pathfinder
Starfinder
Warhammer
2d20 System
Year Zero Engine
Industry News
Reviews
Dragon Reflections
Columns
Weekly Digests
Weekly News Digest
Freebies, Sales & Bundles
RPG Print News
RPG Crowdfunding News
Game Content
ENterplanetary DimENsions
Mythological Figures
Opinion
Worlds of Design
Peregrine's Next
RPG Evolution
Other Columns
From the Freelancing Frontline
Monster ENcyclopedia
WotC/TSR Alumni Look Back
4 Hours w/RSD (Ryan Dancey)
The Road to 3E (Jonathan Tweet)
Greenwood's Realms (Ed Greenwood)
Drawmij's TSR (Jim Ward)
Community
Forums & Topics
Forum List
Latest Posts
Forum list
*Dungeons & Dragons
Level Up: Advanced 5th Edition
D&D Older Editions
*TTRPGs General
*Pathfinder & Starfinder
EN Publishing
*Geek Talk & Media
Search forums
Chat/Discord
Resources
Wiki
Pages
Latest activity
Media
New media
New comments
Search media
Downloads
Latest reviews
Search resources
EN Publishing
Store
EN5ider
Adventures in ZEITGEIST
Awfully Cheerful Engine
What's OLD is NEW
Judge Dredd & The Worlds Of 2000AD
War of the Burning Sky
Level Up: Advanced 5E
Events & Releases
Upcoming Events
Private Events
Featured Events
Socials!
Twitch
YouTube
Facebook (EN Publishing)
Facebook (EN World)
Twitter
Instagram
TikTok
Podcast
Features
Top 5 RPGs Compiled Charts 2004-Present
Adventure Game Industry Market Research Summary (RPGs) V1.0
Ryan Dancey: Acquiring TSR
Q&A With Gary Gygax
D&D Rules FAQs
TSR, WotC, & Paizo: A Comparative History
D&D Pronunciation Guide
Million Dollar TTRPG Kickstarters
Tabletop RPG Podcast Hall of Fame
Eric Noah's Unofficial D&D 3rd Edition News
D&D in the Mainstream
D&D & RPG History
About Morrus
Log in
Register
What's new
Search
Search
Search titles only
By:
Forums & Topics
Forum List
Latest Posts
Forum list
*Dungeons & Dragons
Level Up: Advanced 5th Edition
D&D Older Editions
*TTRPGs General
*Pathfinder & Starfinder
EN Publishing
*Geek Talk & Media
Search forums
Chat/Discord
Menu
Log in
Register
Install the app
Install
The
VOIDRUNNER'S CODEX
is coming! Explore new worlds, fight oppressive empires, fend off fearsome aliens, and wield deadly psionics with this comprehensive boxed set expansion for 5E and A5E!
Community
General Tabletop Discussion
*Dungeons & Dragons
If you use thunderstep but teleport less than 10 feet do you take damage?
JavaScript is disabled. For a better experience, please enable JavaScript in your browser before proceeding.
You are using an out of date browser. It may not display this or other websites correctly.
You should upgrade or use an
alternative browser
.
Reply to thread
Message
<blockquote data-quote="ooshrooms" data-source="post: 8981825" data-attributes="member: 7041243"><p>Wow. I "stumbled across" [hehehe] this a year later and am quite entertained.</p><p>I'm confused at how Maxperson was right that you can't use a reaction to avoid the thunder damage but for the wrong reason. The term "instantaneous" is D&D jargon with a specific meaning not to be replaced by dictionary definitions just like words like "attack." Mechanically, instantaneous duration simply means the spell acts then is gone even if its effects continue, so those effects can't be dispelled. It has nothing to do with how fast the magic actually happens. Look at acid splash. The caster conjures a bubble of acid and physically "hurls" it at a target which can make a DEX save. It's not like pointing a finger before a lightning quick spell effect [pun intended]. You're dodging an acid fastball mid flight or dodging the splatter off of the primary target if you're secondary. Predicting that splatter vector can't possibly be inferred from the body mechanics of the thrower. You're dodging based on real time movement of the acid in air. It's not "that kind of" instantaneous. Nothing in the rule books says that instantaneous spells can't effectively be countered by reactions. If someone wants to waste a high level spell, they could certainly ready telekinesis to grab any thrown weapons and send them back at the attacker, and it would work on acid splash. There's no mechanical reason or logical reason it couldn't.</p><p></p><p>HOWEVER, the text of thunder step DOES indicate you can't run from the thunder. Crawford et. al. use wording like "immediately after you disappear" to indicate that there's no time to stuff a reaction between two connected events, and they both must resolve before a reaction does. If you ready the action of fleeing to trigger on a character disappearing, then someone casts thunder step, when they disappear, your goose is already cooked, because you can't outrun thunder let alone out-crawl it. Thunder damage resolves before you could even make it 5ft. After that resolves, you can flee if you still want to use your reaction. This doesn't affect the topic question though. That revolves around the order of disappearing, reappearing and thunder and not any sort of external reaction. </p><p></p><p>What's even more baffling to me is how Maxperson recognizes that the best explanation for teleportation is going through another plane/dimension but doesn't see it as 2 steps of going from the prime material plane to another realm then returning [but to a different location]; while Lyxen said it doesn't go through another plane but is two steps. If you don't go through another plane, it could work like a wormhole that is one step. If it does, there's two directions of travel. Both seem to be arguing backwards to me. </p><p></p><p>Teleportation should be 2 steps because it's double inter-planar travel even if the time in another realm is exceedingly short. As I've already said, the term instantaneous does not mean that that reappearance and disappearance happen at the same time. The fact that it says that the thunder happens right after disappearance rather than right after teleportation supports this two-step interpretation. The order of events must be disappearance, origin of thunder clap, reappearance. Note that I said "origin" of thunder and not resolution.</p><p></p><p>Here's the twist that allows player/DM interpretation. Since nothing is truly instantaneous in the sense that it takes 0 time to complete, it's possible for the caster to take damage if traveling less than 10' depending on the speeds of the steps. If the thunder clap moves so fast that it passes by the target location before reappearance, there is no damage regardless of destination. If the teleportation happens so fast that reappearance happens before the sound waves pass by, they do damage the caster if (s)he targets within 10' of the origin. The official RAW as mentioned by someone early in the topic from Xanathar is that the caster clarifies and would presumably not take damage. It would be a very minor use of rule 0 for a DM to override that especially if they let it work on the fly and then change interpretation for future use. This shouldn't have been such a long argument. The inconsistency on both sides blew my mind and might be part of why it went so long.</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="ooshrooms, post: 8981825, member: 7041243"] Wow. I "stumbled across" [hehehe] this a year later and am quite entertained. I'm confused at how Maxperson was right that you can't use a reaction to avoid the thunder damage but for the wrong reason. The term "instantaneous" is D&D jargon with a specific meaning not to be replaced by dictionary definitions just like words like "attack." Mechanically, instantaneous duration simply means the spell acts then is gone even if its effects continue, so those effects can't be dispelled. It has nothing to do with how fast the magic actually happens. Look at acid splash. The caster conjures a bubble of acid and physically "hurls" it at a target which can make a DEX save. It's not like pointing a finger before a lightning quick spell effect [pun intended]. You're dodging an acid fastball mid flight or dodging the splatter off of the primary target if you're secondary. Predicting that splatter vector can't possibly be inferred from the body mechanics of the thrower. You're dodging based on real time movement of the acid in air. It's not "that kind of" instantaneous. Nothing in the rule books says that instantaneous spells can't effectively be countered by reactions. If someone wants to waste a high level spell, they could certainly ready telekinesis to grab any thrown weapons and send them back at the attacker, and it would work on acid splash. There's no mechanical reason or logical reason it couldn't. HOWEVER, the text of thunder step DOES indicate you can't run from the thunder. Crawford et. al. use wording like "immediately after you disappear" to indicate that there's no time to stuff a reaction between two connected events, and they both must resolve before a reaction does. If you ready the action of fleeing to trigger on a character disappearing, then someone casts thunder step, when they disappear, your goose is already cooked, because you can't outrun thunder let alone out-crawl it. Thunder damage resolves before you could even make it 5ft. After that resolves, you can flee if you still want to use your reaction. This doesn't affect the topic question though. That revolves around the order of disappearing, reappearing and thunder and not any sort of external reaction. What's even more baffling to me is how Maxperson recognizes that the best explanation for teleportation is going through another plane/dimension but doesn't see it as 2 steps of going from the prime material plane to another realm then returning [but to a different location]; while Lyxen said it doesn't go through another plane but is two steps. If you don't go through another plane, it could work like a wormhole that is one step. If it does, there's two directions of travel. Both seem to be arguing backwards to me. Teleportation should be 2 steps because it's double inter-planar travel even if the time in another realm is exceedingly short. As I've already said, the term instantaneous does not mean that that reappearance and disappearance happen at the same time. The fact that it says that the thunder happens right after disappearance rather than right after teleportation supports this two-step interpretation. The order of events must be disappearance, origin of thunder clap, reappearance. Note that I said "origin" of thunder and not resolution. Here's the twist that allows player/DM interpretation. Since nothing is truly instantaneous in the sense that it takes 0 time to complete, it's possible for the caster to take damage if traveling less than 10' depending on the speeds of the steps. If the thunder clap moves so fast that it passes by the target location before reappearance, there is no damage regardless of destination. If the teleportation happens so fast that reappearance happens before the sound waves pass by, they do damage the caster if (s)he targets within 10' of the origin. The official RAW as mentioned by someone early in the topic from Xanathar is that the caster clarifies and would presumably not take damage. It would be a very minor use of rule 0 for a DM to override that especially if they let it work on the fly and then change interpretation for future use. This shouldn't have been such a long argument. The inconsistency on both sides blew my mind and might be part of why it went so long. [/QUOTE]
Insert quotes…
Verification
Post reply
Community
General Tabletop Discussion
*Dungeons & Dragons
If you use thunderstep but teleport less than 10 feet do you take damage?
Top